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[Seriphyn]

Check this shit out

Firstly...

Planetary Infrastructure: The assessments already made by pilot Cosmopolite in this communication broadly reflect our own views. Planetary infrastructure can help play a powerful role in the defense and evacuation of planetside citizenry, but one that is ultimately only supplementary. Groundside forces without support in space are only so useful, and run the risk of abduction and interception themselves. Initiate evacuations and deploy infrastructure with due care and diligence, and never trust entirely any intelligence that relies on Sansha broadcasts. It is not our place to say that the citizens of Antem or Anyed were needlessly evacuated – the risk alone would justify the operations in the eyes of many. All that should be noted is that the Sansha have proven themselves capable of effective misinformation campaigns on more than one occasion.

* Seriphyn hears the deafening silence of those who naysayed!

Coincedentally, ties in with this...

Anyway, interesting post. I like the implication that we shouldn't trust everything a Nation actor says in local...

[Bong-cha Jones]

I was waiting for you to respond to this 

[Morwen Lagann]

[mod]This is a subject that, much like the other recent schdidoodles, has the potential to go very pear-shaped, very quickly. Please keep the posting guidelines in mind before you hit the 'Post' button.[/mod]

[Elsebeth Rhiannon]

* Seriphyn hears the deafening silence of those who naysayed!

Dunno. How I read the quoted part is "Ok, nice, whatever, but we'd rather you players of capsuleers stuck to space and didn't do this again, and if you do, we deserve the right to have your ground troops abducted." Which is a way to compromise and handle it in a way that does not contradict anyone's RP, but not really an endorsement of the "you are doing it right" sort.

Anyway, interesting post. I like the implication that we shouldn't trust everything a Nation actor says in local...

Which is problematic, if you ask me. We have no way to interact with the GM except through the actors during an event. An actor says something - how do we verify if it is true or not? Yelling different interpretations and counter-arguments on local, I guess. But many of the counterarguments are such that we could check. In a tabletop, I'd say to the GM, OOC: "I have a planetary installation down there. Do they see these dropships?" And get a yes or no. In a small group shared story-telling game, I'd ask the other players (via IC or OOC), we'd negotiate, someone or consensus would call it.

I cannot do that in this game. We have no OOC contact to the GM, and there's hundreds of players on local. If we are not supposed to believe the actors, how are we supposed to know and/or decide what is the truth that our characters see? Apparently, we can't - what really happened is decided post-event, and it can easily contradict something my character has already done in that event. Total immersion breaker for me.

(I realize the above comes close to "you are doing it wrong". It is not meant as such. Again, if other people want to do this, feel free; the stories that CCP makes post-event still do work as background to me. But prepare to be argued pretty hard IC against all talk of unification against this unique threat, because OOC I just don't wanna do this. )

[Julianus Soter]

Omune Balenne's thread is a painfully transparent attempt at public relations damage control. Why have the Federation representative actor give this briefing? Because he's the most sympathetic, can't be held liable for the outcome of the event, and is Gallente. Fortunately, my character doesn't need to reply to threads to make the required points about CONCORD and such, he can just create them. 

CCP needs to get their head in the game about this. The whole motivation for participation in these events is about to go up in smoke.

First, we can't trust the clues.

We can't trust the NPC actors.

We can't trust ourselves.

Therefor, we're left with wild thrashing about, like the death-roll of an alligator, in a desperate attempt to find 'something' that makes the required impact to participate in the storyline.

That's just the out of character damage. The in-character damage is vastly more widespread and comprehensive.

[Isobel Mitar]

* Seriphyn hears the deafening silence of those who naysayed!

I read Omune Balenne as CCP expressing a wish that people interact with the Sansha incursion events primarily by fighting the Sansha ships in space, and limit the other storytelling stuff to smaller scale things.

I confess my personal preference as a player would be multi-way confrontational scenes involving hundreds of players to be played using the game engine. And I imagine anything else has a potential to become a nightmare (pun intended ) to organize for the event actors.

[Borza]

CCP needs to get their head in the game about this. The whole motivation for participation in these events is about to go up in smoke.

First, we can't trust the clues.

We can't trust the NPC actors.

We can't trust ourselves.

We can't trust CCP to reinforce nodes.

[Vikarion]

This whole situation reminds me of a pen and paper game I once played. The GM would throw a deadly encounter at us. Once we beat it, he'd frown, award us a rusted weapon or some such as loot, and then the storyline would continue with our characters in a worse situation than before every battle.

Unsurprisingly, we quickly found other things we had to do on game night.

This is a "heads I win, tails you lose" situation. If Soter and all the others beat the Sansha, well, it's not even a Pyrrhic victory - the Sansha always manage some abductions, and always get what they came for. If Soter and company don't intercept the Sansha, the Sansha abduct even more people, and get their goal.

In short, nearly the same effect upon the storyline could be had by players simply through not participating at all. Whooopeee. Aren't we excited?

It's also mildly irritating that we can't get a single word out of any of the factions save CONCORD, the Sansha, and the Fed. Despite the fact that no government in history has taken kindly to invasion and kidnapping of citizens, the level of concern being represented is along the lines of what one would expect from a poached egg.

Granted, I understand CCP doesn't have all the time in the world, and that they do have a storyline objective with incursions, but, come on, making a few posts and tossing a few bones isn't that hard.

As it is, we're being railroaded, hard.

[Casiella]

I read the posts in a similar fashion to Else and Isobel: "nice try but that won't always work."

However, that just says to me that CCP wants to encourage players to keep trying new things instead of assuming that PI and passengers are the end game for this.

[Arvo Katsuya]

Confirming that not all the material Omune is saying is true.

But yes... agreeing with Soter this time, and adding that Gallente are naturals at playing the proliferation of fear game, to have people see their perspective. Afterall, how else do you win their vote in the easiest manner than by fabricating something to disturb their mind?

[Seriphyn]

As to why Omune Balenne is talking...out of the four military dev-actors he has had the most personality, and has commented on player-made posts on the IGS numerous times.

Secondly, it may also be giving the Gallente some love. The IGS is full of Amarrians, Minmatar and Caldari. CCP may just be throwing a bone.

Thirdly, the "PI tactic" being "legitimized" and my comment regarding that was more focused around the fact that a handful of people IC/OOC would just say "Nah you never did that" and invalidate it. Separate from its "effectiveness" or whether it is "the solution", purely if it is an "acceptable RP angle".

The whole accusations of godmodding, and responding to that with godmodding, etc.

[Elsebeth Rhiannon]

Well, I still hold the opinion that the invisible dropships are godmodding to begin with, and countering them with invisible ground forces is countering godmodding with more of the same.

Obviously, in this case, the GMs say the godmodded solutions hold. Which makes them true in the game world in my books - but not less godmodding to begin with.

Some people like that sort of stuff, and GMs seem to let it stand, which I suppose is fair considering they started it anyway. So fine, it stands. But at least for myself, that does not mean I like it any more than I did before.

[Arvo Katsuya]

Thirdly, the "PI tactic" being "legitimized" and my comment regarding that was more focused around the fact that a handful of people IC/OOC would just say "Nah you never did that" and invalidate it. Separate from its "effectiveness" or whether it is "the solution", purely if it is an "acceptable RP angle".

It's not so much that I'm questioning the tactic being legit, than me hinting the very action is incredibly ironic for what its meant to do nor are people unaware of the consequences related to using them in this manner.

[Seriphyn]

Moar stuff

I like how Gallentean Omune is...while sufficiently militaristic, he is often questioning the nature of CONCORD and "what truth is"...whereas the Amarr rep is just outright "Death to Sansha", which fits, as the Empire wouldn't exactly compromise, seeking to obliterate the Sansha without pause. And especially without doubting authority, as doubting authority would be doubting God.

[Julianus Soter]

Hilarious that the Amarrians would be subservient to any higher authority than their Empress.