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Author Topic: Why all the faction navies the same? (down with monolithic navies)  (Read 3846 times)

Chowda

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I live in a democratic republic yet I never voted for any of my captains while I was in the navy.  This didn't reflect my culture at all, yet my head didn't explode.

Seriously, the fleets mimic CONCORD the best they can.  That's a good reason for the sameness.
 
« Last Edit: 12 May 2011, 12:59 by Chowda »
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Seriphyn

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A quote from "Under the Sea, the City"

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I was twelve when I was accepted into the Caldari Army. I was strong for my age and I had long since learned what the world did to people.

So we know the State is a highly militarized society, so thus the lines between civil/soldier might blur considerably, with things like training from a young age, conscription, and so on.

Perhaps with the Republic Fleet, these days with a revival in tribal culture, rank is intrinsically tied to standing in your tribe. You cannot go past a certain rank without being of a certain age or have the certain rites of passage within your home tribe. This combines Minmatar culture with the "modern volunteer military" of the Gallenteans. This sounds like something CCP would likely describe imminently, with the blurred lines between tribe and military.

So, really now, with a little discussion between folk, we can see how each of the navies are quite distinct not only from each other, but what we have now. Even if the Caldari Navy may be more conventional in how it uses its personnel, they have training from a young age and so on. The Federation Navy, even as a volunteer force, would be condensed and streamling because of drones/automation, with a large emphasis on officers over hands, unlike the volunteer navies of today. And the Minmatar, as described, would have military rank tied to tribal standing.
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Svetlana Scarlet

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You're griping that none of the military doctrine or organization isn't very well explained -- but virtually nothing about how any of the government institutions in any of the empires is really all that well explained. You're missing the forest for the trees here I think.
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Mithfindel

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As a note, 'mericans do value their Armed forces somewhat. Seriphyn is serving, so I assume he does also see some value for the practitioners of the killing profession. However, assuming that the military is appreciated everywhere is not something that should be taken for granted. In the matter of fact, one of the international CV/resume writing tips around here is "don't mention that you've served in the military".

I work at a technical university - so a good amount of our students are young men. Most of them have been conscripted and served 6/9/12 months, and a good number of them are reserve NCOs or officers. Around here it is mostly indifferent whether you've had served (except that the fact that you've done with it and won't get conscripted once you're hired), but for some old-fashioned companies, being a reserve officer is a good thing.

Enter, say, South America. There might be a few countries where if you're too lazy to have a honest trade and too stupid to be a thug, you end up in the army. And with some luck, participate on the next month's coup. Or the coup the month after that. So soldiers are essentially sharing a profession with muggers.

Now, how would different cultures think about their militaries? Amarr we know that the military is esteemed (hello, military dictatorship disguised as theocracy). Caldari do still remember their independence strugge, so they like their soldier boys and girls. Plus Hethist propaganda during the new war. Gallente - well, pre-war the military was a good option if you couldn't become a clown. After the war broke out, I assume that there's a "revanchist" movement large enough to get the Navy manned, but still, I assume that the majority of the Gallente think of their military as a necessary evil. And finally, the Minmatar are likely divided - between a pacifist faction that wants to build their Republic and realizes that they're back to the slave camps without a military, and a militant faction that thinks the Republic Fleet is full of cowards who don't dare to take the fight to the Amarr (reinforced by the fact that when the Elder-Thukkers invaded to get millions of their brethren killed by Amarrians in the backlash, most of the RF stayed in the Republic).
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Graanvlokkie

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You post all this like you expect to wave our hands hand have CCP fix the PF

The game is the way it is, posting this sort of stuff won't change anything. Go post in the features and Ideas forum on the eve-o website, or the Eve Fiction forum.

Like...what do you want us to do with this? There's nothing to discuss, or debate, you're making a statement for the sake of it. Yes its well written and put together...but there's nothing we can do about it. I could say yes I agree, or no I don't and we could debate the way it should be all day, but that's not the way it is.

Quoting to highlight an unhelpful post which adds nothing to a discussion?

Edit: Yes, neither does my post.
« Last Edit: 13 May 2011, 14:54 by Graanvlokkie »
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Seriphyn

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I gave Masks of Authority a read, it's a good one. Gives an idea of what the "corporate police" do, revealing it's more of a paramilitary. Out there protecting the interests of the corporation whereever they may be, with policework actually being the lowest and least prestigious in the outfit.

I was thinking the Federation Navy, while not the largest compared to the Amarrians, may be the furthest reaching navy in the cluster, designed for force/influence/power projection. It may span the entire cluster, whereas the Amarrian Navy is massive and more designed to cover an equally massive territorial area, acting as a large fist to strike out from the edge of Empire borders.

My thoughts anyway. I hope CCP falls through on these assumptions :X
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Casiella

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I think you mean "follows through", because otherwise you seem to say you hope they don't do what you want. That would confuse me. ;)
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Seriphyn

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Yes. Almost a thousand posts of how I want the EVE World to be, particularly the GalFed.

They will NOT go to waste  :yar:
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Mithfindel

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It is unknown if the Imperial Exploration Fleets are still active. You know, brave Amarrians with the mission to go where no Amarrian has gone before, meet new civilizations and enslave them.
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Nearly every corner of Empire space was first visited by the Navy's exploration corps, which investigates uncharted regions of space and surveys them for possible future conquest. First contact between the Amarr and nearly every other race in New Eden was facilitated through the Navy; sometimes peacefully, but often ending in violence.

So while the territorial fleets might be fitted with Augurors left over from the Day of Darkness, possibly with a few almost brand new Mallers from the days of Vak'Atioth, I'd expect that the exploration fleets - as well as other small crack units such as the Amarr Royal Guard wings/fleets - to be equipped with the best money can buy, and be present abroad and be quite proficient in things people wouldn't believe Amarr can be (guerrilla warfare, highly mobile warfare, etc.)

On the other hand, I'd assume that these days, the Federal Navy is going likely be the most modern navy - most of their ships were mothballed back when they were suffering from lack of manpower. Now that they're re-activating ships and building new ones, the fleet's going to have lots of brand new or retrofitted ships across the board. CalNavy is doing similar things all the time, but I'd assume it's more like a rolling replacement of old ships, so the Fed Navy will have an edge for a moment. Minmatar are just in the middle of a big brainfart, depending on what Shakor does with the money formerly diverted to plot holes - sorry, Elders.
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Verone

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You need to look deeper into the origins of each of the Navies.

When you scrape away the surface name they're VERY different animals, from faction to faction. How they'e run, how they're funded and their operational principles and responsibilities are very different.

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