Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => EVE OOC Summit => Topic started by: Synthia on 30 Jun 2018, 07:47
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Alrighty then. Sani Sabik rp. It could do with some fresh approaches to it, as things are somewhat flat right now.
Now, I've been playing a game on Steam recently, by the name of Cultist Simulator, and it is rather good, with a lot of backstory to it and so on. It has made me think about the nature of Sani Sabik, and how people might want to approach it, with a view to establishing their own take on the source material, of being religious space bad dudes.
So, cultist simulator, you can found a cult, based on particular principles, and the lore in the game has different aspects to it. There's the aspect of "The Lantern", which primarily relates to knowledge and seeing, the aspect of "The Forge" which primarily relates to strength and creation, and so on and so forth.
Which made me think about the nature of the Sani Sabik religion, and the different aspects that it might have, and how those would shape the cults associated with it.
Now, with the whole thing in EVE with the cloning process, and becoming an infomorph and all that, there's the possibility there to work that into an initiation ritual. A mortal candidate undergoes The Ritual, and emerges as an immortal, one of the Chosen, and so on. That's a pretty powerful thing right there. Dress it up with suitable religious trappings and blammo.
But it doesn't stop there. Once immortal, then what ? The objective is to become as one of the Sefrim themselves, a demigod as it were.
So, to do that, we need to choose an aspect for your cult. What does your cult believe is the path to transcendence ?
I can see several paths:
Knowledge - the cult members hope to become all-knowing, to transcend their human nature to become as the Sefrim. Cult rp might revolve around looking for hidden lore and so on. Forbidden knowledge and all that.
Biological enhancement - genetic engineering to become more than human. The Blood Raider Covenant already do this to an extent, according to the books, with gene-modified muscles and so on.
Cybernetic enhancement - the opposite of enhancing the flesh, this would use cybernetic implants and prostheses to achieve the objective of becoming more than human.
Sensation - experience all that is experienceable, these cults would be the likely candidates for the ~weird parties~, and all that. Extravagance and decadence and so on.
Power - by seeking to gain power, such that the universe bends to their will. This could be military power, economic, manufacturing, and so on.
There's probably more aspects that could be thought up, but the important thing is that the aspect guides your cults interpretations of the scriptures.
Undoubtedly, the different cults would clash with each other on occasion, over the different interpretations of the scriptures and so on, but they would tend to work with each other against common enemies (i.e. the Amarr).
So, that's my thoughts. What are yours ?
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I think something interesting (to get more players involved) is a cult where you have competing philosophies. Everyone is trying to become a demigod but you have clashing paths. This would also open things up for some more Sith like political maneuvering, both within and outside.
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Silas' particular take on it leaned more toward Sensation and Power than hidden knowledge. It was almost more of a conspiracy than a cult. One thing that was nice from a Roleplay aspect was that aside from core pillars to their ideology, Silas gave other players a lot of leeway in how to play as part of the conspiracy. It left room for for some individualism where it seems to me that Sabik groups revolve a bit heavily around one particular character. Silas was still the figurehead of Nobilita Nera but within the group while I was there we had players with different areas of focus. Karmilla focused more on plotting and hedonism, Biggus Tankus was focused a bit more on the traditional blood rituals and Red God stuff, and Kalo Askold seemed more focused on PVP and expressing supremacy that way, ultimately forming a faction warfare group.
I suppose the takeaway is, make sure your Sabik RP group allows for different personalities and play styles, but is unified in some way. It also wouldn't hurt to have a backup plan for your group if the primary personality in that group goes away. Both my forays into Sabik RP ended when the ringleader moved on to something else :(
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The problem with Sani Sabik RP is that the best Sani Sabik characters would be impossible to peg as Sani Sabik by anyone but the initiated, at least until they've amassed enough power that no one could threaten them anyway. When the comparatively weak characters start being very public about it, it pretty much always devolves into Edgy Blooblooblood or bad attempts at religious fervor, it seems.
You know what moment I'd imagine would be the best Sani Sabik RP? When a single character manage to betray and take down a corporation/alliance through infiltration etc, reveal that they are Sani Sabik and then just disappear forever back into obscurity and a new harmless and clean identity. A vulgar display of power, skill, manipulation and threat and it'll be publicly Sani Sabik only for that brief moment before it returns to being that hidden yet now demonstrable threat.
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You know what moment I'd imagine would be the best Sani Sabik RP? When a single character manage to betray and take down a corporation/alliance through infiltration etc, reveal that they are Sani Sabik and then just disappear forever back into obscurity and a new harmless and clean identity. A vulgar display of power, skill, manipulation and threat and it'll be publicly Sani Sabik only for that brief moment before it returns to being that hidden yet now demonstrable threat.
I'm still crying over Guiding Hand Social Club failing on their headshot I contracted way back when :bash: Le Sigh.
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Silas' particular take on it leaned more toward Sensation and Power than hidden knowledge. It was almost more of a conspiracy than a cult. One thing that was nice from a Roleplay aspect was that aside from core pillars to their ideology, Silas gave other players a lot of leeway in how to play as part of the conspiracy. It left room for for some individualism where it seems to me that Sabik groups revolve a bit heavily around one particular character. Silas was still the figurehead of Nobilita Nera but within the group while I was there we had players with different areas of focus. Karmilla focused more on plotting and hedonism, Biggus Tankus was focused a bit more on the traditional blood rituals and Red God stuff, and Kalo Askold seemed more focused on PVP and expressing supremacy that way, ultimately forming a faction warfare group.
I suppose the takeaway is, make sure your Sabik RP group allows for different personalities and play styles, but is unified in some way. It also wouldn't hurt to have a backup plan for your group if the primary personality in that group goes away. Both my forays into Sabik RP ended when the ringleader moved on to something else :(
:cube:
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Sabik RP is hard in EVE; power-cults and domination worship run very hard into often edgelord RPers who won't undock. Much more viable and stress free to RP general capsuleer sensory debauchery; running a group of actual pvp killers takes *effort*
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Sabik RP is hard in EVE; power-cults and domination worship run very hard into often edgelord RPers who won't undock. Much more viable and stress free to RP general capsuleer sensory debauchery; running a group of actual pvp killers takes *effort*
Or you just go for max hedonism and throw kick ass parties.
Of course that also means being smart enough to let the competent ones run things behind the scenes.
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Sabik RP is hard in EVE; power-cults and domination worship run very hard into often edgelord RPers who won't undock. Much more viable and stress free to RP general capsuleer sensory debauchery; running a group of actual pvp killers takes *effort*
If you PvP, you're a meanie and a bully!
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running a group of actual pvp killers takes *effort*
Hell, running any sort of organization for an extended duration. It's one of the reasons why FCs and people willing to do org work are worth their weight in gold in EVE.
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PvP and bearing are on entirely different scales though. Can't rely on sites or spawn rates, or anything of that nature when you try to do PvP in Eve. Other players tend to be far less cooperative about schedules and locations. The amount of work a PvP group, particularly organizers, has to put into anything that isn't FW is pretty overwhelming.
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Oh, certainly. Still, organizing takes more work than solo, whatever it is, PvP, bearing, or any sort of community activity.
Hell, any given Discourse episode usually represents between 30 and 50 hours of labor for the crew, excepting those instances where stars align.
Making it solely about the primacy of PvP misses the point: organizing takes work.
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Yea I have to say organizing a bunch of pirates to properly bait and blops and all that shit was easily less effort than listening to 500 private messages and convos about The Summit and complaints from channel member about other mods and drama. RPers be -difficult-, yo :lol:
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People are hard. /o\
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RPers not be people.
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It's simple really...you must make a Cult...then you must actually form a core of people where martial prowess and development and growth is sought after and then try to expand.
In other words, just like anything in life one has to chase the art side of it. Sani Sabik are easy really, because they enjoy a lot of ready to consume lore material from the most looked after faction ( lore wise), the Amarr.
Thus, focus on the conflict with the Amarr in a Cult like level/culture, avoid the hedonistic pitfall, get ready and embrace being hated and disliked properly as a villain without succumbing to trolling/griefing and grandiose false grandeur because or else you ll lose the respect as an RP player. For as long the Amarr empire stands you as Sani Sabik should know you are still a nothing.
And while you benefit from being the antithesis of the most loreful faction in the game, your Cult should have a proposal of what a Sani Sabik Empire looks like.
That's my short version anyway.
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Found some of my old Sani Sabik writings from back when GoGo dabbled with the Blood Raiders, way back when they were stationed in the Bleak Lands. We basically ran that neighborhood for a while. Good times from Eve's ancient past ('05 - from an unbelievable thirteen years ago!).
Anyhow, maybe these are not related to the thread directly, but they might be interesting to see as among the earliest stabs at Blood Raider mythology/philosophy, before there really was such a thing (I dare say some of our stuff like this may have influenced things later on to various degrees...):
The inner sermons of the cults and pacts of our galaxy have as of late been widely disseminated on these forums. In the same vein you're now afforded a glimpse at the secrets of the Sani Sabik.
Look around you at the great empires and the ideologies they propagate. Their sole purpose is to veil and disguise a greater spiritual truth that is verily available to all who have the fortitude to plunge the depths that have been formed inside us by the divine.
At the base of all our spines lies a great coiled serpent. It is sleeping and kept in slumber by the droning sermons of the desperate who cling to their false power. This sacrilege has persisted for so long because they rightly fear the beast that sleeps within us all. If that power was to be awakened their empires would crumble and fall.
The rituals and practices of the Sani Sabik stirred it within me. Like in so many initiates before me, the serpent has awakened and it is beyond our conception. It is beyond all restriction. As countless others before me, I've become the bearer of the blade that will cut away the chains of our bondage.
Originally those who discovered these truths became reviled by their own kind. The Amarr empire forbade the sect and they became forsaken by their own. Their wisdom is considered apocrypha by their extant church. So, now the Sani Sabik dwell deep in the Bleak Lands, where further progress is continually made on the path originally set upon. Work continues unabated, both with continued introspection and with the latest technologies -- Jovian or otherwise. We move in both directions of the axis mundi: inward and outward.
This is the aeon of the Resurrection of the Soul, when at last the spirit becomes free of its incumbent flesh. Only by state of the art technology and fearless spiritual insight unchained by moral boundaries can this be accomplished. It is the final correction of our souls.
Nothing is sacred, all is allowed. Let that be our solemn prayer as we sharpen the sacrificial blade.
The inner sermons of the cults and pacts of our galaxy have as of late been widely disseminated on these forums. In the same vein you're now afforded a second glimpse at the secrets of the Sani Sabik.
History, as the playground of the divine, works through a mechanism of eternal conflict. A seed of divinity festers within us and only through strife does it come to grow. The swift movement of God's hand is as pregnant with danger as it is with wisdom. We need only to look around us for evidence of this. Without the slow dying of stars themselves, we would not have life itself. Without pain, there would be no awareness of disease and no chance of remedy. So do all the events of our history become a gradual movement towards greater realization and the final correction.
Observe for a moment one of the great struggles of our time: the Amarr domination of the Matari and their subsequent rise in rebellion. Doubtlessly have the Matari tribes been made to suffer at the hands of the Amarr crusaders, but as reality as our witness, it has been to their ultimate benefit: without this great struggle, they would not have come to be where they stand today.
Pious and laborous, the Amarr have realized that the idle pursuit of one's desires is not freedom, it is a slavery far worse than the one they inflict on those whom they consider lesser races. Yet, in their conceit and arrogance they fail to see that the Matari are their greatest success. Their hatred of their empire is not a sign of their failure, but of their triumph.
While the other slave races toil at the level of worms, only the rebels have emerged from their slave-cocoon as something greater than they were and in becoming the great nemesis of what the Amarr represent, they now offer the wisdom they gained back to their masters. Stripped bare, their bodies lashed with the wet lipped crimson grins of their oppressors' whips, their souls bared before the eye of God, the Matari have by necessity come to understand themselves. Now they impart this wisdom back on their enemies. It is wisdom brought by the hail of projectile fire, but that it is wisdom, of that there is no doubt.
Adversity is our mentor, and stagnation our true enemy.
"If you're holding on and afraid of dying, you'll see demons tearing your life apart. If you've made your peace, then the demons are really angels freeing you from the world."
and a previously unpublished one (the ones above were posted on an early incarnation of the IGS):
Sermons of the Knife (#3)
The inner sermons of the cults and pacts of our galaxy have as of late been widely disseminated on these forums. In this continuing series of revelations, you are now afforded a third glimpse at the secrets of the Sani Sabik.
While countless generations of humanity have spent their years toiling in the mud, searching for their destinies in all the wrong places, secret orders of initiates have laboured verily towards our undeniable destiny. Until the promised land is reached, omniscience and immortality has been solely reserved for the divine. But through the great work, our souls slowly spiral towards the final correction that bridges the great gap that was wedged between the scattered souls and the God that beget them.
At first technology allowed us to transcend the limitations of our body. The mechanism of the lever permitted us to vastly increase our physical strength. Then as advanced computers developed the capability of uniting into state-of-the-art datanets came the technology of the mind that already elevated us into advanced beings. Now we have the technology of the soul at our disposal and the possibilities that follow are without boundary.
Progress along this path is certain, as is that the road leads to Divinity. While our technology is not flawless, our capabilities to advance it become greater by the year. Having nearly conquered death for the elite among us, we've been granted the final gift that will allow us to claim what is rightfully ours. Our predecessors lamented that there was only so little time in the world and that they could not accomplish all the deeds that lay dormant within them. Now, our time is practically unlimited. We are closer to achieving our goal than ever before.
The Jovians have already journeyed along this path, and those who are afraid, caution us with the circumstances of their fall. History always goes from crisis to crisis, creating the fertile ground for the greatest among us to inherit the coming promised land. The Jovians were not destinied for this. This is ours alone!
Only the fearless and the bold are destinied to become the gods in the coming age.
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Good material, that :)
I've got a few pages from various Pax Dominata, etc I might dig up as well for those still working out their own material or looking for what folks have done in the past
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I think as referenced elsewhere here, one of the keys to doing the Sani thing is putting your own individual spin on things. It's one of the nicer things about Sabik in that most of the other player factions have a very defined 'box' to work within. That box is of course broad and only as narrow as your imagination, but the archetypes for the empires and pirate factions are quite fleshed out in lore and game history, Blood Raiders included.
Sabik stuff is sort of this decentralized buffet of various power cults and fanatic criminal organizations, the eve roleplayer can sort of mix and match and have their own branch up and running with their own proclivities and have quite a bit of fun.
It's what I always enjoyed about it at least; the longer-term Sabik RPers all kind of had their own 'take' on the material and at least I felt they were all quite unique. Some more 'successful' as far as fleshed out characters than others, of course.
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I think one of the most important things here is to get over the initial rejection most roleplayers have to all things Sani. And by that I mean the unwillingness to get SERIOUSLY involved with one. Everybody talks on the IGS, often with no seriousness whatsoever, but to TRULY get Sani Sabik RP accepted, you really need to go one step further.
I'm not going to make any bones about this: Sani Sabik is a terrible subject to RP. The lore itself and the characters themselves offer almost no ways to hook somebody in on that concept. This is a setting where mass generational slavery is accepted, and these guys are considered too much.
That means that you need to rely on the force of the character you are playing. Your character will need to seriously engage people who seem sceptical but at least open to dealings with her, and pretty much rope them in on charisma. On being such a pleasant presence that ,eventually, you can open their minds just a smidge to your way of thinking.
That, I think, is interesting, and also a way to make Sani RP viable. Play the guy with charisma 100, be subtle, be sweet, be absolutely endearing and hook people in very, very slowly.
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I dunno about all that, plenty of Sabik in the lore are little more than Gallente goth kids essentialy. There's a whole range from Gallente pop stars to infomercial self help queens to actual blooders
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I think a differentiation has to be made between a violent atheist who likes to be edgy and spray themselves in blood, and a violent theist who believes in Sani Sabik dogma.
Ritual is informed by dogma, and not the other way around. Covering yourself in blood all day and calling yourself Sani Sabik because you wear some Blood Raider apparel from Hot Topic doesn't make your character one -- it makes them for all intents and purposes, an edgy hipster. Just covering yourself in blood all the time, in context, is equivalent to an orthodox Amarr just covering themselves in sacred water all day and without any meaning as to what the blood or water is meant to represent spiritually or in terms of dogma.
As for my thoughts on the Sabik Sabik:
What could be considered 'Orthodox' Sani Sabik tenets originates with House Khanid during the early days of the Reclaiming. Its dogma is a mix of monotheism and pagan ritualism which is no different historically speaking, to the type of belief systems in Scandanavia or Eastern Europe that arose when Christianity started intermixing with the local pagan beliefs. The Amarr Holders of Khanid had to allow some leeway on the Khanid pagan beliefs because they needed them to fight the Udorians.
The result?
The Khanid started interpreting Amarr Scriptures through the lens of paganism and went on a bloody rampage -- I'm probably talking Golden Horde levels of sheer brutality, the sacking of Baghdad level, or rape of Kiev style massacres in the name of 'Reclaiming' the infidels. Initially the Council of Apostles turned a blind eye to all this because hey, winning! Eventually though, the Khanid did something just so utterly savage that the Council of Apostles went:
Dude... Khanid guys... Dude, I mean... What in the actual fuck?!
And removed all the bits of Scripture the Khanid were using to justify their bloodthirsty style of Reclaiming.
The Khanid Holders however went, nope, keeping that!
So I think when talking about Sani Sabik there are is the belief system that is millenia old in House Khanid among its Holders, and there's stuff like the Sani Sabik lite editions they peddle out to co-opt proxies in the interests of the Khanid Kingdom -- Blood Raiders, Dochuta Karsoth etc.
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God I love that idea so much. It makes perfect sense.
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The focus on physical blood has been probably the worse thing I have seen from Sani Sabik players (and, honestly, CCP too. Ugh, CCP). It completely misses the point of what a religion is. Blood is a symbolic element that represents, among other things, the life force. Sani Sabik wouldn't go around using blood just because edgy. Is Christianity about worshiping crosses? No. The cross is just a symbol of a very important religious event and takes prominence in the religion because of that. Sanism would use blood because it has an important symbolic place in their spirituality. To make Sani Sabik rp interesting and viable, in my eyes, you need to approach it as someone actually religious. Ignore the blood completely and instead focus on the ideology of what Sanism is about. Despite the name, despite the imagery, blood is subsidiary. As Veik said, ritual follows dogma, not the other way around.
At its core, Sanism is about egotism and self-improvement. Self-realization. It's a religion focused on the idea that the strong rise while the weak fall. This is inspired by orthodox Amarrian religion, of course, but with one key difference: In orthodox Amarrian the idea of what is strong and weak are stagnant. They are defined, among other things, by bloodline. A person is at the top of the hierarchy because they are True Amarr, because they were born into the noble class, because their parents or their parents' parents performed deeds of honor and remembrance. Sanism, by contrast, treats this idea more fluidly. A strong person is a person who is able to seize their destiny. A weak person is someone who lacks the strength to do that. In both orthodox Amarr and in Sanism, the idea stands that the person at the top is given greater rights and privileges, though Amarr give while the Sani Sabik take. The Amarr still fall under a hierarchy of 'always serving one higher' (thus making holders, heirs, and emperors still inferior to angels and god), while the Sanists believe in breaking the hierarchy.
This is why commoners often fall into Sanist faiths, because it is a religion that teaches that you are not stuck to the position you were born in. This is also why, according to Source, Amarr believe that Minmatar who meld Amarrian faith with traditional Minmatar beliefs looks awfully similar to Sanism. Minmatar beliefs have a lot of that 'be yourself' mentality that Sanists preach.
And this is why hedonism has always played a central role in Sanist faiths. Because the strong have earned the power to accomplish all of their wishes and desires. Your emotions, your wants, your lusts, all of these things are you and should not be hidden or restrained. A Sanist is, to borrow a certain Sith line, a "breaker of chains".
So what is the blood about, then? It's hard to say exactly, but my thought would be it stems from the Amarrian idea of certain bloodlines having more power than others. Sanists believe that consuming or otherwise taking this blood confers that power unto themselves, or otherwise proves that their own blood is stronger. The strength in the blood isn't about what you are born with, it is what you are able to take. Kind of vampiric, in a way - diablarie (http://whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Diablerie_(VTM)).
Here are things I would expect from a Sanist believer:
1) Catiz, Khanid, the Minmatar, and the Caldari, are likely all held with very high esteem by the blooders, because they represent people who, at least in part, took charge of their own destinies, against the will of those who ruled them. Everyone was trying to keep them down, but they fought against these pressures and came out the victors.
2) Clones are considered pure because capsuleers are some of the most free people in all of New Eden. Capsuleers are a class of people who tick many of the boxes for being 'savants' to the blood raiders. Ergo, a blooder wishing to prove themselves a savant would consider the blooding of a capsuleer clone to be among the highest of honors. It represents having power over capsuleers. Why were children considered the purest before that? Probably relating to the idea that most children are "free" at birth, and rules and restraints are imposed on them during their upbringing. The younger the child, the less of those restraints have been drilled into them, and thus the 'more free', and thus pure, they are.
3) Blooders treat their slaves abysmally because A) the blooder has risen to a level of power over others, and B) because those slaves have demonstrated to lack the power to break themselves out of slavery, and are thus worth no care or love. If, however, a blooder slave were to fight their masters and achieve freedom, the blooders would probably look on that former slave with great respect. The fact that most don't is, to the blooder mindset, a sign of weakness and submission that proves they deserve their fate.
4) Sanists to me have a sort of Mormon-like relation to God (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apotheosis#Church_of_Jesus_Christ_of_Latter-day_Saints). The idea that you can elevate yourself to God's level, to become a god yourself in equal standing with him. "As man now is, God once was: As God now is, man may be." This is also another strong correlation between Sanists and Khanid - the Khanid symbol could very much be interpreted this way, with the arrow pointing up representing mankind ascending to apotheosis. I'm pretty much convinced Khanid society is not only aligned with blooders but outright inspired by blooder theology, with Khanid himself seeking apotheosis in the Sanist sense. Khanid society is still heavily Amarrian orthodox in style, it's not quite as 'free' or 'equal' as a true Sanist society, but it absolutely has elements of Sanist belief.
5) As mentioned already in this thread, gene-modding, cybernetic advancement, capsuleering, exploration, learning and research, even just basic exercise, any kind of means of advancing human potential fit very well in with Sanist beliefs. It is defined by ambition, pushing ever forwards into becoming the perfect being above all others. There is no lazy, content Sanist.
(disclaimer: don't take that literally. Of course there's lazy, content Sanists. But passiveness, inactivity, submission, and refusing to stand up for yourself would be looked upon very, very poorly among Sanists)
How does this all translate to RP? Well, simply, as in everything, build a character who actually understands and believes in this. Don't be an edgy teenagers with a blood fetish. Try to understand what the belief actually entails and act in a way that lives up to that belief. It would be very possible, in my eyes, to create a Sanist character that is actually widely respected and appreciated, a character whose religious beliefs would be viewed more favorably than Amarrian ones.
That's not to say you can't do a proper evil Sanist/blooder too, keeping in line with the same beliefs, using tactics as described by several people already in this thread (infiltration, deception, etc).
In conclusion, I don't consider Sanism, by its nature, to be 'religious space bad dudes'. It, of course, has plenty of potentiality of being religious space bad dudes, but it also has a lot of potential for being religious space good dudes, depending on how a character interprets the beliefs, spinning the desire for personal freedom positively or negatively. The problem is, most people don't do either angle well, because religion is one of those things that a lot of people in our modern, growingly areligious culture don't really understand. There's always too much focus on the window dressing, not the substance of the religion. It's a common problem in RP in general - putting the aesthetics before the character. Religion is a core belief system that colors your entire perspective on the rest of the world. It does not, by its nature, make you good or evil, or force you to act in any particular way, excepting in how you read into its teachings and in what ways you choose to act on those teachings. Focus on what the teachings say, not on a set of tropes you think represent them.
Good RL references to use, IMO, for playing Sanism, would be any Left-Hand religious system, that focuses on self-realization and the personal will in antagonism against submission and normal social conventions. Things like Thelema, or Luciferian Satanism. Important note here: I'm not trying to state any of these systems are bad by comparing them to Sanism. Rather, I view it that Sanism is not evil at its core, but rather that it is a legitimate religious belief system capable of being a positive force that has been taken to evil extremes by certain groups of radicals like the blood raiders. In this way do I see Sanist RP capable of being an interesting and viable thing, when it is actually taken seriously as a religion instead of just lolevil.
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Damn. Good. Post.
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Well I suppose that explains why the Kingdom and State get along so well. They are both in their own ways, highly meritocratic societies. :lol:
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Mhmm. Although the Kingdom is only really meritocratic in theory. Like any system involving negative freedom, it becomes too easy for the person already in power to ensure no one else will never reach their level, even if technically everyone has the potential to. Same thing goes for people in Tash-Murkon. You may be able to buy slaves and probably noble titles as a commoner in the kingdom, thus pulling yourself up, but the chances of you actually getting the opportunity to do so is probably very rare in practice.
Similar, again, to the way the blooders treat their slaves. They might really respect someone who pushes themselves out of the muck and into power, but the way the system is set up means the chances of that happening are incredibly low.
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Though, on the blood stuff in Sanism rituals, I think it has similar overtones to the philosophy of Vitalism (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vitalism):
Vitalism is the belief that "living organisms are fundamentally different from non-living entities because they contain some non-physical element or are governed by different principles than are inanimate things". Where vitalism explicitly invokes a vital principle, that element is often referred to as the "vital spark", "energy" or "élan vital", which some equate with the soul.
Yeah it's a pseudoscience, but this is religion we're talking about here.
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Yeah, I likey that. Basically how I've seen it.
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The focus on physical blood has been probably the worse thing I have seen from Sani Sabik players (and, honestly, CCP too. Ugh, CCP).
yes. lolspacevampires. Appeared in some ingame items - do you remember those old ship log things you used to get sometimes from belt npcs ? There was mention of actually drinking/eating blood in a couple of those.
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The focus on physical blood has been probably the worse thing I have seen from Sani Sabik players (and, honestly, CCP too. Ugh, CCP).
yes. lolspacevampires. Appeared in some ingame items - do you remember those old ship log things you used to get sometimes from belt npcs ? There was mention of actually drinking/eating blood in a couple of those.
I don't actually mind eating/drinking blood. That is fine. There are plenty of religious systems were the consumption of blood or other organs is an important aspect (taking in the strength or other traits from the person/animal whose blood is consumed, etc). And there's plenty of ways to prepare blood in a way in which it can be safely eaten. And I can absolutely see that being an important part of some Sanist sects.
The problem, as in everything, is in the execution. People failing to understand why a religious system would have rituals that involve the consumption of blood and just doing it for the edgy evil imagery. Or people doing it divorced from religious ritual (which is what is common with the blooders... that whole assembly line esque blooding shit they do doesn't feel like a legitimate religious ritual, just :edge:). Consuming blood shouldn't be about the coolness/villainous factor of it. It should be about achieving a spiritual purpose.
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Have you ever read the Explanatory Leaflet ?
Graelyn was pretty impressed by it afaik.
I don't have a local copy, and can't get ingame to find it though.
Pretty sure it covered most of what you're saying, about a reason why blood is important and so on, rather than just "lolblood"
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This is all of course difficult when the prime "Blood Raider" lore is all about hooking up vast swaths of poor souls to machines and blenders and much twirling of mustaches. I've always looked at Omir's sect as sort of the worst example underneath a wide umbrella that CCP never explores. Blood Raiders being the main onramp for new players learning about Sabik stuff, hence all the vast herp derping that comes down the RP pipe.
I would give good money and vital, pure blood for CCP to just kill Omir already and take the "Raiders" in a more interesting and less cringe direction.
Khanid II was of course Sabik in everything but name, believe it.
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Have you ever read the Explanatory Leaflet ?
Graelyn was pretty impressed by it afaik.
I don't have a local copy, and can't get ingame to find it though.
Pretty sure it covered most of what you're saying, about a reason why blood is important and so on, rather than just "lolblood"
It is a leaflet that explains!
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It also severely misunderstands both religion and the importance blood can have in them. It "fixes" a problem that doesn't exist, while creating something kind of nonsensical as far as religions go.
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It would be kind of neat if there were some measurable game mechanic for baseliner support for capsuleers. Like some way to check if the Mizhara fan club across the cluster is doing well or whatever. Maybe something related to standings or something, I dunno. Might make the religious capsuleers fighting over devotees or acolytes more interesting :)
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Have you ever read the Explanatory Leaflet ?
Graelyn was pretty impressed by it afaik.
I don't have a local copy, and can't get ingame to find it though.
Pretty sure it covered most of what you're saying, about a reason why blood is important and so on, rather than just "lolblood"
I do not believe I have read the actual thing, no, just references to things from it.
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It also severely misunderstands both religion and the importance blood can have in them. It "fixes" a problem that doesn't exist, while creating something kind of nonsensical as far as religions go.
What are you referring to here ?
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I would give good money and vital, pure blood for CCP to just kill Omir already and take the "Raiders" in a more interesting and less cringe direction.
If you want a laugh, read the thread on the IGS called "The Time of Shame Approacheth"
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Samira definitely points out the interesting things about Sani Sabik RP and it's a shame that CCP focus more on SPACE VAMPIRES!!!!!!!
It also made me think about Serpentis RP. Currently I am not really sure what to chase with a Serpentis character but I think they have one major thing in common with the Sanist: Power. Initially the story about the Serpentis builds on Vengeance, but vengeance alone can't really support a whole faction and currently it feels like the goal of a Serpentis character would in some way be similar to a Sanist character. But this is also where the similarities ends as a Sanist will seek power through religion, intrigues, violence, and so on. While a Serpentis character would probably focus more on technology, economy, and status. After all the Serpentis has a meritocracy structure similar to the Caldari.
Sorry for being a bit off topic, this could probably be a thread for itself but at the same time there are some similarities.
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I would give good money and vital, pure blood for CCP to just kill Omir already and take the "Raiders" in a more interesting and less cringe direction.
If you want a laugh, read the thread on the IGS called "The Time of Shame Approacheth"
those new forum layouts are icky. good god.
Ah yea I had seen they are doing recurring yearly Blood Raider dumb dumb stuff. They've been doing this with the other pirate factions, right? Good lord, content team.
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I particularly enjoyed the Valentine's Angel event where they decided to use named characters for the first time.
Nothing like breaking all sense of immersion by having a pair of people in thousands of locations simultaneously, on a date, allowing themselves to be blown up over and over again for two weeks.
:bash:
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I particularly enjoyed the Valentine's Angel event where they decided to use named characters for the first time.
Nothing like breaking all sense of immersion by having a pair of people in thousands of locations simultaneously, on a date, allowing themselves to be blown up over and over again for two weeks.
:bash:
They probably are in good company with that Damsel that's been in distress mission since 2006 or something, she's been saved like, a million times already :P
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Yeeeaaaah.
Unfortunately, while it's canon due to it being in the game, we sort of have to handwave anything involved in missions. "Um, there are things like this happening all the time. Let's, uh, just not count the numbers."
Not unlike the untold billions being slaughtered by AFK VNIs, Ishtars, and by ratting carriers and supercarriers every day forever and ever.
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I particularly enjoyed the Valentine's Angel event where they decided to use named characters for the first time.
Nothing like breaking all sense of immersion by having a pair of people in thousands of locations simultaneously, on a date, allowing themselves to be blown up over and over again for two weeks.
:bash:
They probably are in good company with that Damsel that's been in distress mission since 2006 or something, she's been saved like, a million times already :P
it's a big cluster. I just assume there's a lot of stupid hormonal teenagers and the general scenario just happens over and over :P