Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => EVE OOC Summit => Topic started by: Creep on 22 May 2013, 19:26
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Hardly the first capsuleer admiral to take own life after losing tremendously important ship in rather humiliating circumstances... blasting a crater in the original homeworld of the Caldari isn't something I'd want on my record.
I would have thought that scarring the spiritual heart of an entire nation would be precisely the sort of thing Mr. Shogaatsu would want on his record. Is Istvaan becoming a patriot?
/summon Muck Raker
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Istvaan's always seemed to have a sentimental attachment to the State, Creep. It's one of the reasons Aria gets a little fangirlish about him.
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Istvaan's always seemed to have a sentimental attachment to the State, Creep. It's one of the reasons Aria gets a little fangirlish about him.
Huh. I thought he was attached to the Amarr.
Oh whatever, it's probably all misdirection and deceit anyways.
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Gwen should give the story of what Istvaan did to her at Silas's party and the aftermath to Muck Raker. I'm sure she'd have a field day.
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Istvaan's always seemed to have a sentimental attachment to the State, Creep. It's one of the reasons Aria gets a little fangirlish about him.
Huh. I thought he was attached to the Amarr.
Oh whatever, it's probably all misdirection and deceit anyways.
If so, it's a long game indeed.
Istvaan himself is Caldari, and has always come across as partisan in the Empyrean War even if he does not personally take part. Maybe these are his real feelings, maybe not, and I'm sure Istvaan wouldn't let any lingering loyalties slow him down if there were some specific gain in betraying them, but the pattern's long-running enough to suggest that he has a certain sympathy for New Eden's authoritarians.
That's my impression, anyway. He frequents this forum, so maybe he'll have something to say about it himself.
Gwen should give the story of what Istvaan did to her at Silas's party and the aftermath to Muck Raker. I'm sure she'd have a field day.
Blood Raider parties seem like something that Muck Raker would love all kinds of details about-- especially guest lists. Istvaan's specific doings would make a nicely salacious tidbit, but I suspect she'd want all kinds of other info.
It would limit how much she has to make up.
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Gwen should give the story of what Istvaan did to her at Silas's party and the aftermath to Muck Raker. I'm sure she'd have a field day.
What happened there? :P
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Gwen should give the story of what Istvaan did to her at Silas's party and the aftermath to Muck Raker. I'm sure she'd have a field day.
What did he do ?
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With the amount of drugs Mr. Shogaatsu does, it's likely he doesn't have a clue about which nation he's currenly in, only the vaguest clue about which one he's from, and certainly no inclination to sort out his precise loyalty and feelings towards any of them.
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Meanwhile, in an alternate universe....
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-zH0zIgHkt7M/T5SZFiFD3tI/AAAAAAAAE-s/udHQbcMuleI/s1600/casablanca+rick+and+renault+humphrey+bogart+claude+rains+in+ricks+1942+4_copy0.jpg)
Graelyn: What in heaven's name brought you to Amarr?
Istvaan: My health. I came to Amarr for the waters.
Graelyn: The waters? What waters? We're in the desert.
Istvaan: I was misinformed.
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I play Istvaan pretty carefully without betraying many hints of allegiance, so I'm pretty amazed that you picked up on that. And yes, "drug-obliterated human wreck that barely remembers where he's from" plays into it heavily as well.
And yeah, at the core, he's still Caldari, though he doesn't consciously consider himself as such anymore. Subconsciously, he derives his hatred of Gallenteans, his homophobia, and his racism toward Minmatar from that element of his past. He definitely was a Caldari patriot once, but only residual elements of that remain. He's seen too much out in space to have much loyalty left to a single dirtball, and would probably only take notice if that dirtball and everything he once was, suddenly ceased to exist (foreshadowing). He's one of the few capsuleers around with direct evidence of the big, scary shadow play behind Sarum and Heth and The Other, and literally knows the universe is about to up-end itself in a truly spectacular manner - in a way, his scope has expanded beyond nations, so Caldari isn't the first thing he thinks of when he looks to identify himself. One shouldn't forget that he's a complete and utter sociopath, and will always identify himself as himself first, with family/friends coming second, people whose power he desires third, and everyone else being largely inconsequential. He's been a megacorporate CEO, then he became a capsuleer, then he became the godfather of a criminal organization the whole goddamn charted universe still fears... each step moving him further away from what he was, but each step of what he was still shaping what he is.
Another aspect of the character is his loyalty to his own, which I see as inspired by Caldari loyalty, whether to home, state, parent corporation, whatever. So perhaps not a complete 100% sociopath. There's that one value. He may be a drug addled thief who doesn't bat an eye at killing thousands, but damned if he doesn't have one redeeming value. If you fuck with someone he considers important to him, he'll go Niko Bellic on you.
Ooh, I got to yammer on about my character. I am pleased.
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dblpost
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He's one of the few capsuleers around with direct evidence of the big, scary shadow play behind Sarum and Heth and The Other, and literally knows the universe is about to up-end itself in a truly spectacular manner -
Usually, if someone said this about their character, I'd go 'lol godmoding', but this is Istvaan Shogaatsu, and I suspect you probably do have legitimate spoilers acquired ingame that the rest of us do not (particularly since your fan fiction in the past has been...prophetic). Damn you, old man!
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Spoilers from CCP actors ?
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Spoilers from CCP actors ?
Or out of game, since he runs EON, doesn't he? But yeah, kind of like when Verone was approached by Sansha regarding the Kyonoke virus, I can easily imagine a character mailing Shogaatsu with a "Hey, we're holding a massive cataclysm that will rock the very foundations of the universe, could you cater it?"
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Nah, nothing from CCP actors, ever. And I don't run EON, I just wrote for it a bit :p I do however work under the assumption that the end of Eve was written when it began, and that there's a "bible" somewhere guiding its plot. I could be wrong, but so far my guesses have proven right, and if you know all roads lead to Rome, you can guess some of the turns and crossroads...
Anyway, this is the reason I don't like anyone giving Tony G. shit. He didn't invent any of the crazy shit he wrote about, if my theory holds. He just wrote about an existing plot that has been unfolding for a very long time. It's also why I like the character of Jamyl Sarum so much... the stuff I always knew to be in the background is coming to the fore through Jamyl. The most recent Jamyl Chron is *so much like* my early EC stories, right down to italicizing the mysterious head-voice's lines, that I find myself renewed in addiction to Eve's storyline. If my guesses for the future are right, those of you discomforted by Jamyl's psychic powers ain't seen shit yet. We're going to war with the gods, and I don't think us winning is in the books.
The prophecy of Macaper holds the key! ;p
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Interesting.
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(http://www.derper.com/images/50360e001d41c8769e00002d.jpg)
Just wanted to contribute to this fine thread here.
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Well, interesting, but that doesn't explain why Istvaan knows about all of this then ? :confused:
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Well, interesting, but that doesn't explain why Istvaan knows about all of this then ? :confused:
He doesn't 'know', it's guesswork.
Istvaan is just quite good at guessing.
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Yeah, I recall Eva telling us a whole bunch of 'crazy guesswork' complete with footnotes to the ICly available info it was drawn from, that a year or so later turned up in CCP PF.
It's all there, people. You just need to dredge for it.
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Well, interesting, but that doesn't explain why Istvaan knows about all of this then ? :confused:
Istvaan knows about it, because a decade ago, what happens to Jamyl now, also happened to him. In fact, that thing happening to him back then, is why Istvaan did all the awesome things he's done throughout his lifetime, and why he's always been so insufferably successful.
Long story short: Istvaan started as a frigate pilot for a corporation called Means to an End. This corporation was escorting a KK personnel transport on an uneventful trip, and then the formation disappeared into a stargate for four years, and came out all weird. This is when Istvaan and the others started hearing the voice. The former KK personnel and the MtaE pilots then formed Endless Corporation, which became one of New Eden's first capsuleer megacorps. It expanded very rapidly, becoming involved in military industry, and became the first Caldari capsuleer corp to make business contact with the Amarr - specifically, Sabaoth Inc., allied to... the Sarum family... where Endless traded high technology for Sabaoth's access to, let's say, willing manpower. All the while, as they amassed power, Endless Corp were working on a secret project - an "Incursion gate" or a stargate leading to nowhere. This secret project was worked on under the guidance of the voice.
While this was going on, another faction of humans, whom we'll call the Navigators, was compelling yet another faction called the Daas, or Das Paragon, to interfere with Endless Corporation's activities, having been informed by Jovians that Endless Corporation is just a puppet for some unknown and malign great force in the universe. Endless Corp and Das Paragon enter a state of cold, then hot war, both of them merely chess pieces being moved on a board, literally not knowing what they're doing because it's so damn mysterious. It all comes to a head when the Daas discover the incursion gate, huge battle ensues, at first the Daas look like they're losing, but eventually they persevere, and... pull a 300-year old dying explorer from the gate before Endless can get to him themselves and complete whatever nefarious thing they were doing.
In his dying breath, the explorer warns the Daas of things no-one in New Eden knows about. Things that live in the space between stargates. Things that watch us, and plan to make use of us for their own ends.
Unfortunately for the Daas, the battle against Endless Corporation at the incursion gate forces them to withdraw most of their Home Guard. Then Istvaan dispatches two cruisers full of nerve gas to Daasa, the Daas homeworld, and kills them all before word can spread. (That's the genocide I refer to in my CONCORD criminal data sheet, by the way.) At this point, the voice leaves Istvaan and the other "posssessed" EC alone. Whatever its needs were, they were met.
All this was written a decade ago, by yours truly and a number of other talented writers.
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Whatever its needs were, they were met.
Or failed.
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Uh, ok... I must be dumb because I did not understand the slightest thing... : |
Yeah, I recall Eva telling us a whole bunch of 'crazy guesswork' complete with footnotes to the ICly available info it was drawn from, that a year or so later turned up in CCP PF.
It's all there, people. You just need to dredge for it.
Where ?
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The prophecy of Macaper holds the key! ;p
Yes.
Unnnnngh this thread is awesome. Thank you for the write-up, Isty.
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I remember reading the story about the assault on the incursion gate. At the time I took it to be a decent EVE/Warhammer 40K crossover, or possibly EVE/Cthulhu Mythos. It never occurred to be that it might reflect CCP canon at all.
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I remember reading the story about the assault on the incursion gate. At the time I took it to be a decent EVE/Warhammer 40K crossover, or possibly EVE/Cthulhu Mythos. It never occurred to be that it might reflect CCP canon at all.
Where might I find this?
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It's archived but it's in a terrible state. It used to be on a lovely webpage which has since collapsed a number of times, only to be salvaged time and time again.
edit: here we go:
http://eve.klaki.net/ec/fiction/
The stories are out of order, many are missing, and I must remind any who read them that when I wrote them I was 10 years younger than I am today. My eyes blister at the sight of these grammar fuckups. The story with the big battle is titled Heaven, but the others are all about events leading up to Heaven.
Anyway, feel free to pore over the skeleton of the Endless Corporation, as it remains on the internet. It's a small window into what roleplay looked like in the earliest days of Eve :p
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I remember reading the story about the assault on the incursion gate. At the time I took it to be a decent EVE/Warhammer 40K crossover, or possibly EVE/Cthulhu Mythos. It never occurred to be that it might reflect CCP canon at all.
Coincidentally, I cite H.P. Lovecraft as one of my primary literary influences. Him, and Frank Herbert. From Lovecraft comes the cosmic horror, from Herbert the plots within plots and penchant for convoluted intrigue that spans across time. One day, when I am almost dead, I aspire to be as good a writer as these men. Not nearly there yet.
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Are these stories based on ingame events ?
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When these stories were written, there was no game yet, or it was in its earliest, most rudimentary form. That's why none of the place names in my old stories correspond to places on TQ today - the alpha/beta was done in a small constellation that no longer exists. I miss Enelaise.
All we had to go on, was a small number of chronicles (called Peek of the Week back then), short stories, and other elements of setting that got us all addicted to the game that would be Eve. We developed our own stories from these.
It's funny, but now that I think about it, the whole thing with the Amarr Empire and Caldari State being buddies pretty much started with us... Endless Corporation and Sabaoth Inc, that is. When we announced our alliance, the Eve community of the day went through a mild uproar, because it was completely unthinkable for the hard-working Caldari to ally with the slave-driving Amarr.
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ARSE COCK BOLLOCKS, I keep hitting quote when I mean to hit modify. Dblpost, disregard.
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When these stories were written, there was no game yet, or it was in its earliest, most rudimentary form. That's why none of the place names in my old stories correspond to places on TQ today - the alpha/beta was done in a small constellation that no longer exists. I miss Enelaise.
All we had to go on, was a small number of chronicles (called Peek of the Week back then), short stories, and other elements of setting that got us all addicted to the game that would be Eve. We developed our own stories from these.
It's funny, but now that I think about it, the whole thing with the Amarr Empire and Caldari State being buddies pretty much started with us... Endless Corporation and Sabaoth Inc, that is. When we announced our alliance, the Eve community of the day went through a mild uproar, because it was completely unthinkable for the hard-working Caldari to ally with the slave-driving Amarr.
/me sits down cross-legged with his chin in the palms of his hands.
Storytime! Tell us more about the old days, Grandad! What was Enelaise like?
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Well, for one thing, Eve felt a lot more... epic. I'm sure this is just memory being coloured by fondness, but I remember frigates feeling like a jumbo jet, not a gnat. No microwarpdrives back in those earliest days, so everything moved ponderously and all space-like, with mass to it. There was also a tremendous heavy bass effect to some weapons like missiles and artillery, that rattled your whole desk if your subwoofer was turned up. Everything felt enormous, like it was happening in a giant echo chamber, not crisp and fast as it is today, but dulled by the void, molassy and dream-like. Ships didn't turn on a dime, but in ponderous arcs. Hard to describe. I'm probably imagining how it felt as a first impression.
edit: Fortunately, there's an early CCP video I just recalled that captures these elements exactly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryJZnXfvKNo&list=PL2F3AAA33E78369DA
Tell me you didn't get chills :|
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I liked Sabaoth (sort-of...Grae would have tried to destroy them, probably unsuccessfully).
I wish these old corps could resurface sometime.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryJZnXfvKNo&list=PL2F3AAA33E78369DA
Tell me you didn't get chills :|
Those missile wsssh-whumps.
Also, that sebbie at the end just made me long for the days when we could make our characters look like this:
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jXxGpgOmnLg/UFrp691JowI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/Yp8hhyGQ3HQ/s1600/eiko-ishioka-the-cell-tarsem-singh-jennifer-lopez.jpg)
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Uh, ok... I must be dumb because I did not understand the slightest thing... : |
Yeah, I recall Eva telling us a whole bunch of 'crazy guesswork' complete with footnotes to the ICly available info it was drawn from, that a year or so later turned up in CCP PF.
It's all there, people. You just need to dredge for it.
Where ?
In the chrons and news stories and events and so on.
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I liked Sabaoth (sort-of...Grae would have tried to destroy them, probably unsuccessfully).
I wish these old corps could resurface sometime.
Elements of those old corps do resurface. In the story series that ended up predicting Doriam's assassination and Jamyl's return, I retrieved one character from cold storage, quite literally. This character originated in those beta-era stories, and the series revisited some old haunts as well. One long chain of continuity.
I have been the same character since the very beginningest beginning. Starts as a lowly charter/escort pilot. Gets possessed by cosmic horror. Forcibly takes over minor Caldari corporation, turns it into evil megacorp. Cosmic horror fucks off, leaving newly minted pilot a CEO and cursed with probability-defying success. Pilot starts doing fuckloads of drugs, realizing everything he's been taught is a lie, and what else can you do at that point but say fuck you to reality, pretty much accidentally becoming a godfather of crime by virtue of the connections made while under the cosmic horror's influence. Character retrieved from cold storage who was formerly a corporate enforcer goon, is now a criminal enforcer goon in main character's criminal organization. Links in a chain. Everything, connected. My character even keeps a few canisters of... well, let's just leave that for the future. In case I decide to start writing again. Gluehuehuehue.
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Whatever its needs were, they were met.
Or failed.
I wanted to address this specifically. It doesn't fail. It evolved beyond that long ago.
In the end, we aren't meant to win. We're the other guys in a Xanatos gambit where the issuer literally has foreseen all possible consequences and eventualities, and it's all according to plan *twiddle fingers*. Eve is a tale of apocalypse. Fallen empires. In the end, a pre-singularity civilization encountering one whose singularity already came and went, giving ample time for said civilization to get comfy with actual godhood. The Greeks, as it turns out, were right - Gods are dicks. The Jovians tried to lead by example, showing us what becomes of humanity when they strive toward godhood. They gave us the capsule to show us how immortality turns us murderous. We are on the side of the gate that clung to humanity, with Jovians its careful, ever-present gardeners. When that bitch cracks open, we're going to find out just how severe a mistake staying meat was. You just watch. Youuuuu just watch. DOOM! Doom comes for you all!
Oh, and before anyone else starts thinking this is a secret leak of CCP canon, please pay attention to my forum title, 'cause I'm pulling this out of my ass.
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Well, for one thing, Eve felt a lot more... epic. I'm sure this is just memory being coloured by fondness, but I remember frigates feeling like a jumbo jet, not a gnat. No microwarpdrives back in those earliest days, so everything moved ponderously and all space-like, with mass to it. There was also a tremendous heavy bass effect to some weapons like missiles and artillery, that rattled your whole desk if your subwoofer was turned up. Everything felt enormous, like it was happening in a giant echo chamber, not crisp and fast as it is today, but dulled by the void, molassy and dream-like. Ships didn't turn on a dime, but in ponderous arcs. Hard to describe. I'm probably imagining how it felt as a first impression.
edit: Fortunately, there's an early CCP video I just recalled that captures these elements exactly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryJZnXfvKNo&list=PL2F3AAA33E78369DA
Tell me you didn't get chills :|
This is so true and speaks about a large part of what really lured me into Eve in the early day. It is a shame some of that has been lost. The feeling was certainly quite Homeworldy, too. I did like some of your stories because your writing style reflected the Eve-style rather well.
Whether you predicted or influenced the Eve storyline, I'm not sure, but I did enjoy that's what happened when Jamyl popped back up. Probably predicted though because the clue was certainly there. Nor am I sure a bible existed outside the head of particular developers until a later point or if it was indeed very detailed in regards to the overall plot.
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"Predicted" is adequate. Only my character is egomaniacal enough to immediately claim credit for "influence" - I'm not :p
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I don't see it as necessitating egomania, really. They're just people at CCP and not immune to taking in influences. A lot of their employers come from among the players anyway and they most certainly have been influenced by other players, bringing in the things they've liked and possibly weaving them into the storyline. CCP also does like to take pride (at least publicly) in the fact that Eve is a sort of co-creation with the players and I do think it sometimes extends to setting detail.
Whether that instance was prediction or influence (and I'm leaning a little on prediction myself all things considered), it's safe to say plenty of folks in the RP (and non-RP) community have influenced how Eve is today, you most certainly included if not by anything else then at least by GHSC becoming a sort of mythic exemplar of one kind of activity and tone which permeates the game. And CCP folks, by accepting that as an influence, become more susceptible to accepting other influence from you.
But surely the master manipulator already knows this! How meta would that be anyway? GHSC taking over CCP. Then you could certainly validate the voice forever.
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Well, for one thing, Eve felt a lot more... epic. I'm sure this is just memory being coloured by fondness, but I remember frigates feeling like a jumbo jet, not a gnat. No microwarpdrives back in those earliest days, so everything moved ponderously and all space-like, with mass to it. There was also a tremendous heavy bass effect to some weapons like missiles and artillery, that rattled your whole desk if your subwoofer was turned up. Everything felt enormous, like it was happening in a giant echo chamber, not crisp and fast as it is today, but dulled by the void, molassy and dream-like. Ships didn't turn on a dime, but in ponderous arcs. Hard to describe. I'm probably imagining how it felt as a first impression.
edit: Fortunately, there's an early CCP video I just recalled that captures these elements exactly.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryJZnXfvKNo&list=PL2F3AAA33E78369DA
Tell me you didn't get chills :|
Yeah, old days had a more "homeworld" atmosphere without the persian influences - I am pretty sure that Homeworld was actually one of their main inspirations.
I also remember that ships always faced the direction of their speed vector in the past yeah, making them more akin to jets rather than actual spaceships: now they behave more like they do in homeworld, paradoxically, facing the direction they want to go, before actually starting to go that way...
Uh, ok... I must be dumb because I did not understand the slightest thing... : |
Yeah, I recall Eva telling us a whole bunch of 'crazy guesswork' complete with footnotes to the ICly available info it was drawn from, that a year or so later turned up in CCP PF.
It's all there, people. You just need to dredge for it.
Where ?
In the chrons and news stories and events and so on.
Not convinced... Still sounds very godmoddy to me.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryJZnXfvKNo&list=PL2F3AAA33E78369DA
Tell me you didn't get chills :|
Those missile wsssh-whumps.
Also, that sebbie at the end just made me long for the days when we could make our characters look like this:
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-jXxGpgOmnLg/UFrp691JowI/AAAAAAAAAVQ/Yp8hhyGQ3HQ/s1600/eiko-ishioka-the-cell-tarsem-singh-jennifer-lopez.jpg)
Where does that come from Creep ? Seems to ring a very old bell...
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The Cell. That's Jennifer Lopez.
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I hated that movie.
Visually splendid though.
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That's what I heard as well.
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Whatever its needs were, they were met.
Or failed.
I wanted to address this specifically. It doesn't fail. It evolved beyond that long ago.
In the end, we aren't meant to win. We're the other guys in a Xanatos gambit where the issuer literally has foreseen all possible consequences and eventualities, and it's all according to plan *twiddle fingers*. Eve is a tale of apocalypse. Fallen empires. In the end, a pre-singularity civilization encountering one whose singularity already came and went, giving ample time for said civilization to get comfy with actual godhood. The Greeks, as it turns out, were right - Gods are dicks. The Jovians tried to lead by example, showing us what becomes of humanity when they strive toward godhood. They gave us the capsule to show us how immortality turns us murderous. We are on the side of the gate that clung to humanity, with Jovians its careful, ever-present gardeners. When that bitch cracks open, we're going to find out just how severe a mistake staying meat was. You just watch. Youuuuu just watch. DOOM! Doom comes for you all!
Oh, and before anyone else starts thinking this is a secret leak of CCP canon, please pay attention to my forum title, 'cause I'm pulling this out of my ass.
I do hope this is not the case. In my view an MMO or, come to that, any setting with a lot of players who are outside of immediate GM control is a very bad place to implement pre-determined arcs that the players have absolutely no effect on. Unless the arcs have no effect on the players that is and are merely there for colour.
Setting a grim tone is one thing. Making the whole thing lead up to some sort of SF Ragnarok is quite another.
Also, I'd be very surprised if CCP actually put real psychic powers into the game. I believe it's already been demonstrated (in Templar One IIRC) that the zombie empress gets her stuff through sufficiently advanced technology.