Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => CCP Public Library => Topic started by: BloodBird on 24 Mar 2013, 10:30
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http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Luminate_Era_of_the_Gallente_Federation
Some time ago a new, awesomely detailed article on the Federation's extensive history was made (Thanks CCP :cube:) and I made a point out of reading it and taking it to heart. I would only return to re-read if there were things I was not so sure about or feared I had forgotten.
Recent IGS treads made me re-read this, and apparently there have been some rather significant changes made, I'm not sure when.
Among other things, I can't recall seeing any details about the Achura in this article anywhere, despite that fact they were IIRC Federation members before they joined the State, and all other Federation member-races have entries and parts about them, there is even a great deal about the Mannar.
Some other changes have been made as well, among them more details about the bombardment of Caldari Prime. Previously the only clear number of fatalities were 'hudnred of thousands' now it's a more realistic mention of millions, and further, millions of Federal dead as well.
There is a very significant part about a one-year cease-fire that basically allowed the State to cherry-pick whoever they wanted for the evacuation, torpedoing any claims about 'evacing under fire' right out of the water, and it also details the Caldari offensive actions in effectively taking huge stretches of space in Verge Vendor, Sinq and so on. A great deal more here now that details the 'bad' of both factions.
I like it. I like it a lot.
But can anyone of us trust that our RP arguments will not be rendered obsolete again by any further changes to the PF?
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But can anyone of us trust that our RP arguments will not be rendered obsolete again by any further changes to the PF?
No.
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Among other things, I can't recall seeing any details about the Achura in this article anywhere, despite that fact they were IIRC Federation members before they joined the State, and all other Federation member-races have entries and parts about them, there is even a great deal about the Mannar.
That is because the Achura were not part of the Federation. From the moment I started reading Caldari Lore, that's always been the case as far as I have seen. The Achura were discovered by the State/Caldari, and integrated because both sides had plenty to gain from it. If the Federation article (which is recently written) included the Achura as a Federation member at all, it was probably removed because it was contradicting established PF elsewhere.
Keep in mind you can search the page's history. It's a wiki, and maintains a record of all changes. If your Achura entry was ever in there, it would be in the history.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wikiEN/index.php?title=Luminate_Era_of_the_Gallente_Federation&action=history
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The Achura was never in the Federation? That contradicts the old PF stating they left the Fed and joined the State when the latter seceded, it even had a sad factual error claiming this took place 300 years ago, ergo 100 years before the start of the war even.
*EDIT* Thanks for the link to the revision history page, even if reading through that log makes me feel a tad uneasy for a couple reasons.
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There is a very significant part about a one-year cease-fire that basically allowed the State to cherry-pick whoever they wanted for the evacuation, torpedoing any claims about 'evacing under fire' right out of the water.
At the time of the Hueremont incident, three quarters of the population had been evacuated - under war conditions - from the planet. The ceasefire took place afterwards, and while this is new to me it does mean that the evacuation could be completed, even the most remote population centers, etc.
This does most certainly not torpedo any claims made in the past.
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I was more referring to claims made that people would have to be left behind because the evacuation was under warfare conditions. This might be true for the pre-Hueremont time but once the cease-fire was in effect the State would be able to go back and pick up just about anyone they wanted. Players have made claims that part of the reasons for returning to CP was to liberate the population. If they had a year to evac the remaining quarter of the population then the fact there were anyone left when the last ship took off means those left behind wanted to be there, either as guerrilla fighters or fed-aligned citizens, or possibly die-hards who did not want to leave for any reason.
I'm sorry I should have been more clear.
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Oh yeah, that is absolutely true. The decision to return to CP was not one made for the people living on the planet, who should be an absolute stunning majority of offspring of gallente settlers that (were) relocated there after the evacuation, with minorities being gallenteans that have lived their during the time before.
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Among other things, I can't recall seeing any details about the Achura in this article anywhere, despite that fact they were IIRC Federation members before they joined the State, and all other Federation member-races have entries and parts about them, there is even a great deal about the Mannar.
That is because the Achura were not part of the Federation. From the moment I started reading Caldari Lore, that's always been the case as far as I have seen. The Achura were discovered by the State/Caldari, and integrated because both sides had plenty to gain from it. If the Federation article (which is recently written) included the Achura as a Federation member at all, it was probably removed because it was contradicting established PF elsewhere.
Keep in mind you can search the page's history. It's a wiki, and maintains a record of all changes. If your Achura entry was ever in there, it would be in the history.
http://wiki.eveonline.com/wikiEN/index.php?title=Luminate_Era_of_the_Gallente_Federation&action=history
I might be one of those old chronicle pages, but I too remember Achura being a part of the Federation and seceding along with the Caldari not because of 'State, fuck yeah!' but because it made most sense to them geographically and they wished to retain their cultural identity. Which in turn got fucked as SuVee ravaged Saisio with both culturally and for resources ( now retconned too ).
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Which in turn got fucked as SuVee ravaged Saisio with both culturally and for resources ( now retconned too ).
That's been retconned? What?
I don't know what to think anymore.
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Which in turn got fucked as SuVee ravaged Saisio with both culturally and for resources ( now retconned too ).
That's been retconned? What?
I don't know what to think anymore.
This is why it's always best to ask why someone not lining up with PF is not lining up with PF ... because odds are they're lining up with what PF was last time they read it ...
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Influenced by Sukuuvestaa, the Achura decided to join the Caldari in their secession as a client state. Their pre-industrial Achura Empire had been discovered by SuVee during the secret colonization many decades prior, and was uprooted and replaced by minority Caldari rule. This mostly affected major population centers, which were modernized to become full cities according to the Caldari standard. The rural areas were mostly ignored, dotted with thousands of Achura monasteries. Some were displaced for mining operations, but for the most part, Achura who had not been assimilated remained reclusive and introverted[4]. Only during the beginning of the capsuleer era would the Achura acquire interstellar recognition as many sought out pod pilot training.
Only piece of Lore (http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Demographics_of_the_Caldari_State#History) I could find regarding Achura first contact. Doesn't seem like SuVee ravaging was retconned, although the language used appears ambigious.
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http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Government_of_the_Gallente_Federation
The founding members were the nations of the Gallente, Caldari, Intaki, and Mannar homeworlds, signing the treaty known as the Federal Charter. Other members would join over time (such as the Achura), but would lack the size or influence of the founding races.
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"The story is meant to be dynamic and you should be happy that your character has something to feel conflicted over."
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Unfortunately, I think retcons are inevitable given the amount of sheer expansion that CCP is doing with these new text dumps (which make me both :bash: and :cube: ). I think CCP also seems to downplay the role of the Jove in terms of the creation of CONCORD, making it a much more Gallente-centric process than Jove.
Of course, maybe that's just what I want to remember, lol. Stupid memory, why are you not perfect.
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The bit about the Achura and the Federation comes, I believe, from the same place as Achura and the sciences or Achura and martial arts-- details on the bloodline that you get when making an Achur character in Eve. A large percentage of information on the bloodline comes from character creation; it's well worth mining for data.
Sadly, I don't presently have access.
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Unfortunately, I think retcons are inevitable given the amount of sheer expansion that CCP is doing with these new text dumps (which make me both :bash: and :cube: ). I think CCP also seems to downplay the role of the Jove in terms of the creation of CONCORD, making it a much more Gallente-centric process than Jove.
Of course, maybe that's just what I want to remember, lol. Stupid memory, why are you not perfect.
It has always been more or less Aidonis + Heideran, the true figures of CONCORD creation. However the Jove have always been quietly supporting behind.
Maybe they were more than that before, but I don't remember well enough.