Backstage - OOC Forums
Archives => Katacombs => Topic started by: Andreus Ixiris on 04 Nov 2013, 13:50
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So you may have noticed Slaver Filth stopped posting recently. Yeah, it turns out all you guys had to do was actually talk to him.
You're welcome.
[mod]Flamebait. Implied accusations of inaction/intolerance of other forum users.[/mod]
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And what, pray tell, was motivating anyone to have a serious conversation with him?
Certainly not the excessively terrible level of quality in his posting or behavior towards other people.
When you start posting about beastiality rape fantasies involving other characters, or claiming you have inside info from CCP devs, on an IC forum, the odds of people having any reason to discuss anything seriously with you rapidly approach zero.
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Oh please, it is far from having happened right at the first day. People could have talked to him before.
Easy to say after, granted, yes.
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He was posting like that from day one. Those are only two particularly egregious examples that managed to garner enough attention from ISD and CCL that he got posts nuked off the forum for.
It's a very simple concept: if you want people to actually engage you in serious discussion and talk to you rather than calling you a godmodding troll, you don't shitpost in the manner he was.
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I'm not going to argue and make you change your mind anyway since it's doomed to no end.
I have read his posts and even if slightly godmodding, they looked more or less sensible for the first days. Which is also what made me post my first answer to that very topic. I even liked a few of them, before being confronted to what followed (that lolbiography, evelopedia, etc).
Matar Ronin was better, not a character I would applaud, but it's hardly the only daft extremist we see on those boards.
Maybe next time i'll try to have a talk OOCly to those sooner like Andreus showed here and see what it does. Not really my thing (I am an introvert, so yes, i've said it) but you would be amazed to see how it can work at times, not always, far from it, but more than we think as you long as you keep civil. And it costs nothing anyway.
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I don't know, the fact that I just naturally assumed someone had tried it before me? Given how vocal people usually are when someone's Doing It Wrong (which incidentally I am very, very interested to learn is something that Backstage acknowledges as an actual thing that you can do when it comes to EVE roleplay) I had assumed at least one person offended by his actions would actually have tried to calmly bring up what was upsetting them with him. I'm not joking. I genuinely believed that one of the many people in this thread complaining about him would actually have at least tried to reason with him.
Nikita Alterana - who is now (at least as far as I understand it) Saede Riordan, one of this board's regulars - was nowhere near as bad as Slaver Filth by any possible stretch of the imagination but both I and Stitcher found ourselves rolling our eyes at some of the stuff she did in her early days of roleplaying (she was another one of the people who decided she was 2cool4capsules). She actively admitted it, as a matter of fact, and said she found those elements of her early roleplaying embarassing to think about. And lest people think I'm singling her out for some reason, I'm absolutely sure that a lot of other people on this board have moments from the early days of their roleplaying experiences they'd rather be quietly forgotten - hell, I'm absolutely not exempt from this issue. I have more than a few, "ancient Intakan" chief among them (I'll be interested to see how many of you remember that).
I can understand that at his worst people would have given up talking to him - hell, in my EVEmail to this guy I actually pointed out that I was pretty much convinced he was trolling and thus couldn't be reasoned with. I have to admit even I was pretty surprised when he gave me a (somewhat) reasonable response, and immediately stopped acting out on the forums. But are you seriously telling me that not a single one of you actually thought to talk to him back when it all started, before it got completely out of hand? He didn't say it outright but that's the impression I got from him, that no-one bothered to tell him what he was doing wrong.
And you know what's even worse? I can't help but feel that if this were a thread about pretty much anyone else in the EVE Online roleplay community, even people like Niraia or Alizabeth Vea, it would (and certainly should) have been shut down by the moderators ages ago. This is basically a thread where a guy who - despite being, I'll admit it, not entirely undeservedly - is getting raked over the coals by everyone, pretty much for your amusement. And God only help the OP if this had been a thread about someone popular, like Scherezad.
[mod]Continued flamebait. Same as first post.[/mod]
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I love you Andreus, now and always. :cube:
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Have you reported the thread, Andreus ? Honestly complaining will do nothing if no report has been submitted, and I can't tell that I don't agree with that.
Honestly I would like to believe I did because i'm pretty sure it crossed my mind a few times (hell it even crossed Silas mind in the OP) but i'm not sure if I really did anymore... :/
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I won't speak for the other moderators, but apparently it's flown way over people's heads yet again: I elected to post, rather than even consider taking moderation action of any sort, because moderating in this thread would have constituted a conflict of interest, having been the target of some of his exceptionally far-beyond-the-line-of-acceptable behavior.
The entire time this thread has been around, only one post was reported, and it wasn't the OP. Nor was it reported by more than one person. Of the moderation staff who had anything to say about it, not one agreed with the assessment of the person making the report.
There is a difference between saying "You are RPing <XYZ> wrong," and saying "if you're looking for such-and-such a response, you are not likely to get it if you keep doing things the way you are doing things." The former is what this forum discourages. The latter is not.
If you'll pardon the more direct example, it's the difference between me saying that you RP an atheist wrong, and me telling you that if your goal is to not have Andreus-c look like a massive hypocrite, then aggressively proselytizing atheism while yelling at anyone religious for proselytizing isn't going to help him there.
Edit: No, Lyn, you did not.
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Given how vocal people usually are when someone's Doing It Wrong (which incidentally I am very, very interested to learn is something that Backstage acknowledges as an actual thing that you can do when it comes to EVE roleplay) I had assumed at least one person offended by his actions would actually have tried to calmly bring up what was upsetting them with him.
I don't see why you'd make that assumption, given how you claim to feel about my corporation's RP, and how calmly you discuss it with any of us.
[mod]Do not respond to flamebait with more flamebait.[/mod]
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I love you Andreus, now and always. :cube:
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I don't see why you'd make that assumption, given how you claim to feel about my corporation's RP, and how calmly you discuss it with any of us.
In the case of Slaver Filth, he was an unknown factor. It didn't feel to me as if I'd be completely wasting my time if I tried.
[mod]Same as before: flamebait, responding to flamebait, casting aspersions of motivations/attitudes of other users.[/mod]
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I won't speak for the other moderators, but apparently it's flown way over people's heads yet again: I elected to post, rather than even consider taking moderation action of any sort, because moderating in this thread would have constituted a conflict of interest, having been the target of some of his exceptionally far-beyond-the-line-of-acceptable behavior.
Aren't you sure you are not overreacting that a bit ? I mean, it was gross and all, but it was not even directed at someone real, just at a fictional character, and it did not even happen to her... It was just.... threats... Like so many of them.
Maybe it's just about sensibilities I guess... I find it really poor taste myself and probably offensive to read, but well... It's not like there are no people in New Eden ready to trash talk like that at every opportunity, since it's the same IRL...
Good call CCP mods decided to snip it though. It was definitely out of the line as stated in the IGS rules.
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As the first person to reply after the OP, I'll throw my hat into the ring.
I'm usually one to assume someone is trying to RP decently. Even Vea can attest to the fact that we were fast friends at first and I regularly attempted to stick up for her. Sometimes it doesn't work out, but generally speaking I don't often give up on someone before meeting them.
Did I try to contact him? No.
Do I ever reply to him in the IGS or is my character even involved in the discussions? Also no.
I have and had no reason to say anything to the guy, because I don't have a bone in those roleplays. I haven't even been reading his posts much, or anyone else's in those threads.
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In any case that particular scene looks to me like one of those sad dramas where both sides probably failed at some point to correct the issue before it went.... how do you say ? Pear shaped ?
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I didn't see the point of talking to a character with what looks like a troll name, behaving like a troll.
I wouldn't expect any players of Gallente characters to see any point in talking to a character called "Airhead Gallente Girl", that behaved like a troll either.
vOv
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Well at the very least, he's no longer posting stuff on the IGS that offends people. So the outcome of talking to him was still positive.
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People did try to talk to him earlier on, actually. They kept posting.
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I, for one, am pleased the Backstage community has people willing to reach out and communicate with other players who are perceived to be "doing it wrong".
[spoiler]You are personally entitled to be as fundamentally awful at roleplay as you damn well please (although you clearly didn't need my approval to do so).
The only thing that actually offends me about Church of the Crimson Saivour and similar individuals (Slaver Filth, Constantin Baracca to a lesser extent) is that you're so bad at what you do that it actually embarasses the rapidly diminishing number of old-guard Amarrian roleplayers who possess both actual talent and the patience to stick around hoping that things get better - Rodj Blake, Nicoletta Mithra, Aldrith Shutaq, most of PIE Inc. etcetera.
It's not that you're doing it wrong (although you are). It's that you're doing wrong by other people.
Aldrith disagrees btw. As does Stitcher, Ghost Hunter, Morwen, and several others.[/spoiler]
[mod]More flamebait and response to flamebait.[/mod]
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I don't see why you'd make that assumption, given how you claim to feel about my corporation's RP, and how calmly you discuss it with any of us.
In the case of Slaver Filth, he was an unknown factor. It didn't feel to me as if I'd be completely wasting my time if I tried.
I, for one, am pleased the Backstage community has people willing to reach out and communicate with other players who are perceived to be "doing it wrong".
[spoiler]You are personally entitled to be as fundamentally awful at roleplay as you damn well please (although you clearly didn't need my approval to do so).
The only thing that actually offends me about Church of the Crimson Saivour and similar individuals (Slaver Filth, Constantin Baracca to a lesser extent) is that you're so bad at what you do that it actually embarasses the rapidly diminishing number of old-guard Amarrian roleplayers who possess both actual talent and the patience to stick around hoping that things get better - Rodj Blake, Nicoletta Mithra, Aldrith Shutaq, most of PIE Inc. etcetera.
It's not that you're doing it wrong (although you are). It's that you're doing wrong by other people.
Aldrith disagrees btw. As does Stitcher, Ghost Hunter, Morwen, and several others.[/spoiler]
You guys should just get a room or something. :roll:
[mod]Nonconstructive. If you're going to report something, report it and move on. Don't respond.[/mod]
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I, for one, am pleased the Backstage community has people willing to reach out and communicate with other players who are perceived to be "doing it wrong".
[spoiler]You are personally entitled to be as fundamentally awful at roleplay as you damn well please (although you clearly didn't need my approval to do so).
The only thing that actually offends me about Church of the Crimson Saivour and similar individuals (Slaver Filth, Constantin Baracca to a lesser extent) is that you're so bad at what you do that it actually embarasses the rapidly diminishing number of old-guard Amarrian roleplayers who possess both actual talent and the patience to stick around hoping that things get better - Rodj Blake, Nicoletta Mithra, Aldrith Shutaq, most of PIE Inc. etcetera.
It's not that you're doing it wrong (although you are). It's that you're doing wrong by other people.
Aldrith disagrees btw. As does Stitcher, Ghost Hunter, Morwen, and several others.[/spoiler]
Yeah, and I stand by what I said. You don't seem to understand the prime fiction of EVE Online or how to portray a convincing or engaging character that isn't based on one of the oldest, tritest sci-fi clichés in history, but there really isn't any point trying to explain that to you because there's essentially no chance you'd actually listen to genuine criticisms even if I bothered to spend the time making them.
It should embarass you that both my interpretation of your observed behaviour and actual, factual evidence thus far has led me to believe that Slaver Filth is more likely to respond to reason than you are, but I strongly suspect you're beyond shame at this point.
[mod]Pattern detected: Flamebait, response to flamebait, YDIW, casting aspersions as to motives/attitudes of other players...[/mod]
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So, what sperg level is this at now?
[mod]Nonconstructive, not appropriate.[/mod]
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Wow. Way to lower the tone, DeadRow. :roll:
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Coming from some of the replies here, the tone was already set.
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I once expected better of you. Nowadays? Not even disappointed.
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I once expected better of you. Nowadays? Not even disappointed.
:lol:
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[mod]Weapons-grade flamebait and responses to it removed. More specific admonitions will be in individual posts. Lack of specific one can be taken to mean reason for inclusion is just "responding to moderated content."
Warnings may or may not be handed out.[/mod]