Backstage - OOC Forums
General Discussion => General Non-RP EVE Discussion => Topic started by: Seriphyn on 28 Jun 2010, 10:28
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Yesterday, some FDU comrades rallied me to a plex in a system that wasn't really under threat. It was a Dominix, triple webbed fit and...well, not how I would normally fit a Domi. I feel in neut range in my Cynabal, and proceeded to be slowly raped and lost the ship. I was pretty emo and mopey afterwards. Today, I lost my Hurricane in similar circumstances. A non-critical plex, against two damn drakes that had me long pointed...I sucked pretty hard in that fight anyway, but was still emo afterwards due to previous loss.
Anyway, I need ISK. I hate missioning. I fall asleep and need to have a nap after just one mission. I can't stand industry or mining. I have zero patience for it, as for trade. I just want to blow stuff up.
In fact, Rhea was brilliantly skilled for industry. I sold her for 3.5bil even so, and I have now no longer have that money, with no long-term investments from it (I had HG slaves, but lost it my warping to a Sansha carrier at zero in a Nemesis -.-). So, now, I'm stuck and befuzzled what to do to make ISKies.
I'd rather not sell PLEXes, as I'd like to keep my money for RL stuff, but does anyone have any ideas? Alternative ways to mission, for example? FW missions i CBB with either, because I have to sell the LP items and I don't want to bother with selling. Lyris Nairn said that the whole Domi omnitank w/ salvage afterwards is now superflous, and it's best to DPS fit your mission boats to blitz all of them...
But yeah, any suggestions? I just cbb with the mundane things to earn ISK lol. I just want ships to blow shit up with.
Thanks for anyone who can suggest, this has my EVE motivation down.
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Exploration can be fun. Hit or miss on the lucrativity scale though.
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Datacores?
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Datacores are good but require missioning to reach the high-level agent. And even then, the income isn't OMG awesome.
Let's see. You've immediately ruled out most of the higher-income professions. Research and exploration, maybe, or farming FW missions (despite your displeasure with missioning) for selling LP store items.
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Scamming, ofc.
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I make a *lot* (Just made my first Billion, in fact) through daytrading. Considering I have middling market skills (Started a month ago) and at present only update orders 1-2 times a day, I'd say that's fairly good for ISK.
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Scamming, ofc.
For those with the OOC ability to pull this off (I'm not one of them :( ), this makes a LOT of ISK.
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Scamming, ofc.
For those with the OOC ability to pull this off (I'm not one of them :( ), this makes a LOT of ISK.
I've actually pondered making an alt just for this purpose. There's some pretty sweet wtb plex scams that I hear work pretty well... >.>
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I made my market alt intending to try scamming. Then I realized normal trading would make me way more.
Still, if you don't *want* to do trading...
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Be careful with PLEX scams. Generally speaking, those will get you banned (unlike normal scams).
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I'm gonna have to go with exploration too, since you asked for alternatives to missioning. Find yourself a nice unexploited backwater of lowsec and just run signatures. Maybe anomalies too if you run out of sigs. Plus, chance of delicious faction/deadspace lewts from expeditions.
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Be careful with PLEX scams. Generally speaking, those will get you banned (unlike normal scams).
Huh, even the one that causes people to get tricked into selling a plex for 300k isk, then turning around and selling it on the market for its 300m value?
That would be pretty lame if people got banned because someone else wasn't reading the wtb contracts very closely.
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Once they're items, they are fair game so far as I know.
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I'd have to go back and dig up the statements, but I recall quite clearly that actively scamming with PLEX was stated as a bannable offense.
Now, making a mistake and selling for 10^3 lower seems like poor decision making rather than actual scamming :)
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Ransoms \o/ Oh wait...
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Scavenging. Follow the violence and npc'ers. Use a blockade runner or a specially-fit cruiser. Fun+profit.
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1. Find corp full of rich carebears and wardec them, offer them a billion isk to drop the dec, with the cost to drop increasing by 1 bil every week that they don't pay it. Make them aware of this, also make them aware you fully intend to keep the dec up until they pay or you run their corp into the ground. They almost always pay.
2. Find highsec research pos owned by a 1 man corp, wardec corp, blow up pos, steal labs, sell them.
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Nice suggestions :3
I am thinking of PI a bit as it is not as dire as other forms of industry from the outset...lots can be RP'd too...how much does it earn relative to lvl4 missions and the like?
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Nice suggestions :3
I am thinking of PI a bit as it is not as dire as other forms of industry from the outset...lots can be RP'd too...how much does it earn relative to lvl4 missions and the like?
Garbage, in comparison.
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PI is good for RP or to support other operations (e.g. POS fuel or construction). It's not a primary income basis.
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There are a couple of things that are profiatable in PI, not many.
Plasma and Lava planets can be used to create certain commodities which will be used in abundance on t2 construction. Those should be a decent, albeit not incredible income. Unless of course everyone is manufacturing those same items.
Oxidizing components are also in high demand, which i haven't discovered exactly why.
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I understand NPC tags from FW plexes make good money.
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Oxidizing compounds can only be harvested from gas giants. As the economy of the system isn't developed yet, the price of things is governed by emotions. Who the hell does pump oxidizing components from a gas giant when you can mine precious metals from lava planets, hell yeah!
...except that supply and demand still do work. Any of the "available only at a specific type of a planet" materials should sell well. These are silicon (lava), industrial fibers (terrestial) and oxidizing compounds (gas). Might have forgotten one. On advanced products, whatever is used in T2 or POS fuel.
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1. Find corp full of rich carebears and wardec them, offer them a billion isk to drop the dec, with the cost to drop increasing by 1 bil every week that they don't pay it. Make them aware of this, also make them aware you fully intend to keep the dec up until they pay or you run their corp into the ground. They almost always pay.
2. Find highsec research pos owned by a 1 man corp, wardec corp, blow up pos, steal labs, sell them.
If they are amarrian or in amarr space I'll help. *grins*
Personally I find missioning w/ two people or getting into active RP while doing it to be my cup of tea. Missioning aint so bad really.
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My greatest asset has been my ability not to lose said assets.
But for RP's sake, I need to be more wreckless. I can afford to lose t1 cruisers t2 fiitted over and over for an extended time, but that's not making full use of Mebs epic combat ship use skill list.
The thing is, if I start using moar t2 ships and, being a returney, losing them to silly mistakes again, I'm gonna start running into serious financial issues. Doesn't help as well that I've fallen below my sacred 1/4bill (a pun on the quarter gill, a drinks measure) safety net since buying a plex to play.
I think I need to take a leaf outta Niki's book, but haven't had the chance to fly highsec for so long :yar:
Currently, I do level 3 missions for various factions:
Blood Raiders (annoying cause their agents are in delve)
Sisters of Eve (annoying cause they're spread out in the cluster epically)
Khanid Navy (annoying cause they often involve missions to shoot blood raiders, which I naturally decline)
There are others, but I haven't used many in ages and have lost access to one or two factions. But missioning is sooooo boring.
I'm tempted to go back to piracy, but I'm such a nub that I'd have embarrassed Verone on how nubby I was. Besides, I'm looking to dec hisec RP targets too and don't really crave the outlaw lifestyle atm as my pvp skillz are not as 1337 as they used to be.
So... what's the laziest ways to make isk that aren't mindnumbing like missioning?
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So... what's the laziest ways to make isk that aren't mindnumbing like missioning?
laziest way tbh is just buying plexes. But since your paying with plexes I'll assume your financial situation is a bit like mine which would make that hard. If you like pvp, the wardec option works really well.
also, the generic trade window scams actually work rather well, just takes a bit of patience, good timing, and your RealLife™ Social Engineering skill at, at least 2, and your Bluffing Skill at 4
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1. Find corp full of rich carebears and wardec them, offer them a billion isk to drop the dec, with the cost to drop increasing by 1 bil every week that they don't pay it. Make them aware of this, also make them aware you fully intend to keep the dec up until they pay or you run their corp into the ground. They almost always pay.
2. Find highsec research pos owned by a 1 man corp, wardec corp, blow up pos, steal labs, sell them.
I approve of this message
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1. Find corp full of rich carebears and wardec them, offer them a billion isk to drop the dec, with the cost to drop increasing by 1 bil every week that they don't pay it. Make them aware of this, also make them aware you fully intend to keep the dec up until they pay or you run their corp into the ground. They almost always pay.
2. Find highsec research pos owned by a 1 man corp, wardec corp, blow up pos, steal labs, sell them.
How many people do you need in your corp to make this a reality, or a viable option?
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Du'uma Fiisi did it with less than five people in our largest fleet against the corps we targeted. Of course, we didn't do POS bashing, but territory denial and constantly hounding their carebears will cause more tears than a POS bash. More personal.
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Du'uma Fiisi did it with less than five people in our largest fleet against the corps we targeted. Of course, we didn't do POS bashing, but territory denial and constantly hounding their carebears will cause more tears than a POS bash. More personal.
That was epic - got a scared noob to sell us their member list for 10 mil - we had a hay day with that. Good times.
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Du'uma Fiisi did it with less than five people in our largest fleet against the corps we targeted. Of course, we didn't do POS bashing, but territory denial and constantly hounding their carebears will cause more tears than a POS bash. More personal.
That was epic - got a scared noob to sell us their member list for 10 mil - we had a hay day with that. Good times.
nice
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"Rhea was brilliantly skilled for industry. I sold her for 3.5bil"
Noob. About a year ago my indy char was less than 35 mill SP and got stolen by a key-logger. He sold the char for 5 billion isk, I did not have that so I asked a friend of a friend to buy her for me so I could pay her back.
Paying her back in PLEX took months, but it was worth it.
Why, you ask?
Because indy characters are a source of endless money. Mining is boring? You are doing it wrong.
Skill alternative indy char to Hulk and perfect mining skills (processing skills at 5 for all high-sec ores in your area) all other skills at 5 or 4 etc, to perfectly fit a Hulk for mining and the skills to perfectly refine the ore. Standing means little - the NPC's take 5% or less, you can live with that.
Dual-box. your alt mines in NPC corp. You sit ready in hauler able to take a full jet-can of ore in one go, or as close as able. Itty5 should do on your main, or the T2 DST. That would be even better.
Alt mines. Main hauls. YOU do something else primarely while doing this. Read book. Watch TV. Watch shows on PC on alternative screen or just pop-up EVE every 3 mintes to empty Hulk and haul on main, if you only got one screen. Hell, you can even write your RP posts to the EVE-O forums or work on your RP stories or whatever. Find something to occupy your time while you mine, simply making sure you keep the ore flowing into that can and that can going back to station on time. Do this as long as you BOTHER, WHEN you bother. Refine ore. Haul it to good market spot and sell. Profit. Work some math to see what ore yealds minerals that is worth most per hour and work on that, upping profit.
Alternative: skill char to T1 production and get some cheap BPO's or BPC's if you want bigger stuff or don't want to invest the money. Build stuff that sells well on market. Ammo. Charges. Popular ships. Whatever sells, not what costs most. Whatever sells on a steady rate.
PRO-TIP: find some HIGH-SEC backwater that don't see much traffic to increase chance of fat ore belts and available build slots of you do that. Mine/refine/haul/build there, sell elsewhere. Optionally skills for ice-mining and possibly proccessing if ice-products sell better than ice blocks then use Macks not hulks. Or do both for variety.
Ore/ice thieves? Leave a can-marker (bookmark, round of ammo, whatever) in the can and save the ore. Ensure the can belongs to main. They steal marker, undock a PVP ship able to take them on and kill them. Yay PVP.
Ofc, you can ignore this advice. You sold your indy char (noob :roll:) and don't like mining. I don't either, if you keep looking at the ore being mined. B.O.R.I.N.G. Do something else in the meantime as adviced. time will flow by while you enjoy yourself, and profit will be okay-ish to very good depending on what ore you get and prices etc. This can be anticipated by working out prize for minerals and how much you get per sycle/per hour and so on. If you do this in advance or make a couple simple checks you will soon see income/hour and if it's worth it to you or not.
Alternatively... there is scamming, corp-theft on alt, griefing in high-sec, extortion rackets, and so on. Mining is a solid income choice, though it needs :effort:
Sleepy. Ranting, repeating myself... off for bed. Good night.
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If you are dual-boxing, I understand that the correct way to do it these days is with a maxed orca pilot with mining ganglinks, along with a maxed hulk pilot with mining upgrades in the lows.
Both shield tanked, orca with cargo rigs, hulk with shield rigs. Both with mining drones IIs.
Considering just how much veld/scord you can pull on your own and sell it raw (plenty of good buy orders for raw ores), i am seriously considering acquiring a 2nd account and go this route. 5 hours a week should net 40-50mill i guess. Problem is investing the time, skills and equipment with a very low RoI.
Regardless if the above is peanuts or allows to blow ships on a regular basis, i presume the original question in this thread was how to make ISK without actually dedicating much time to it and more to combat experiences.
My research lately has been pointing out to do PI manufacturing, buy bulks of processed materials in market, haul and make up specialized or high-tech commodities with a pure factory chain attached to a CC in high-sec. Problem is supply, people are doing closed supply chains and turning profits with the most expensive goods.
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Pure mining in highsec, even with a maxed Orca and Hulk (yes, I have both), will not be much of an ISK-maker. It'll also turn your brain into mush. Trust me. If you want to make money from that, get some friends. An Orca bonus gains potency for every single Hulk you get in the belt. Each Hulk gets a 15% yield bonus, 23-25% reduced cycle time (and 23km range for that matter) and will be able to haul in a decent amount of ore.
That's where corp standings come in. Have at least one of the pilots get enough standings to refine with 0% loss. Do this until you have sold enough ore/minerals to buy researched blueprint originals. One or two will suffice.
On a researched Drake blueprint, I increase the value of the minerals by approximately 5-15% by turning them into Drakes instead, and the time spent manufacturing them is negligible. Same kind of percentage increase from smaller ships as well, and the blueprint originals are cheaper, even researched.
In short, get friends. Do this shit together. Mining/Industry is not a solo venture. You'll gain far more ISK per hour by pooling your efforts together, then splitting the profits in the end. Besides, five/ten people with Orca support will easily strip a few belts in one operation, and that'll be enough for ten battlecruisers or fifty cruisers.
There's a reason Industry corporations exist. They quite simply allow you to make higher profits than you can alone.
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Alt mines. Main hauls. YOU do something else primarely while doing this. Read book. Watch TV. Watch shows on PC on alternative screen or just pop-up EVE every 3 mintes to empty Hulk and haul on main, if you only got one screen. Hell, you can even write your RP posts to the EVE-O forums or work on your RP stories or whatever. Find something to occupy your time while you mine, simply making sure you keep the ore flowing into that can and that can going back to station on time. Do this as long as you BOTHER, WHEN you bother. Refine ore. Haul it to good market spot and sell. Profit. Work some math to see what ore yealds minerals that is worth most per hour and work on that, upping profit.
This is how I funded Zu's early PvP stuff and studied for my finals - sans the hauler sadly - might set that up now...
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This is how I funded Zu's early PvP stuff and studied for my finals - sans the hauler sadly - might set that up now...
This also happen to be my back-up plan in case I get really low on money - I have the needed assets, T2 fitted perfectly skilled Hulk pilot, soon Orca able on my main (currently have orca on Hulk char but can't use both at the same time) and in the worst case scenario I'll just read my books or whatever while slowly emptying belts. No, it's not INSTANT BLOB OF MONEY and it does require a bit of :EFFORT:, but it's a never-ending, stead and fool-proof way of making isk.
Add to this the fact I'm working on improving a corp that, among other things will do this on a major scale, many hulks + orca + T2 DST hauler and you will soon have the ore for your indy jobs.
In my opinion, the whole 'I just wanna blow stuff up and can't be bothered to work for my isk' argument is valid, as MMO's go, but so damn lazy-like. You want to make some isk, decent amounts? That requires some work. Find ways to deal with it. Or sacrifice RL cash for PLEX cards if you can. That's about the least work-needing thing one can do I think, though you still have to sell them for acceptable ammounts.
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Or you could just let someone else do all this and then convince them that giving it all to you is a good idea.
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Rykis is right. Usually I just get my ISK through either stationtrading (with a couple of bill to start with, that'll bring you a hefty income but it takes a lot of 0.02 isk adjustments a day to make it a steady high income. Contract working also works, but it takes a lot of effort to track prices in various tradehubs and nullsec for that to be workable.
But if I need a quicker injection of ISK, I usually run a scam of some sort. I pre-emptively create a couple of alts and let them stew for a month. (I recycle them once a week, so at any given time I have a three-four week alt and some younger ones just growing older) This lets you perform various tasks or make yourself legitimate with different 'yeah, this guy's legit' support from said alts. Keep up the scams until the character is well and truly identified as a scammer, (changing tradehubs can be worthwhile to avoid prematurely biomassing) then transfer ISK to main and biomass. Remake alt to let it grow older.
It's easily one of the finest income sources in Eve, if you got a little bit of patience, a few lacks of morals, and can consider yourself somewhat finely spoken.
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Once again, I will say this for effect...
Making isk in EVE requires some effort. If you mine you need the assets and skills to do it. If you mission you need the assets and skills. You do trading? Funding (it don't grow out your ass) will be needed in soem degree and work to maintain the market orders. Scamming? You will have to have the alts to make it look 'legit' you have to work for them to hit the dumb people who fall for them, you also need that 'silver-tounged criminal' aspect to work.
Even scamming people or making a corp then betraying them all and so on takes effort. You have to work for the gains. You need to find them, make them trust you, lie to their faces, and get away with it until you got what you wanted. There is no 'effortless means of isk' in this game. There never will be.
For the record, I will remain civil and withold personal commenting on my oppinion of scammers and traitors, simply because I don't want al my posts in the catacombs.
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Now, I need to make a distinction here.
Scammers and thieves are two completely different things. Thieves take from you without your knowledge, that's on them. But scammers... you give them the items. How is it of personal fault of the scammer when you are the one giving them the items? If you get scammed, you are the fool and the one at fault.
And perhaps I am speaking for myself, but scamming is :effort:. Talking and selling an idea in an intelligent manner are both things I believe myself to be quite good at. I could sell ice to an eskimo. So scamming is quite easy. I guess if you're not good at it, you need an army of alts or a corp to make it seem legit... but I can say that in nearly 4 years, I've never once used alts to assist in a scam. Now, I've sometimes used an unassociated alt to scam with to avoid attention on the main, but I've never had to bring an alt in to close a deal. Hence :effort:... at least for me