Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => CCP Public Library => Topic started by: Seriphyn on 06 Sep 2010, 10:02
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http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=06-09-10
This has a crapload of information. A mix of an infodump and in-universe philosophy...the definitive chron for the channel RPer
- Capsuleers can hang out with the general populace, called "baselining" or "b-lining", but it seems CONCORD aren't happy about this, and if you're spotted...
- A whole bunch of faction PF regarding the Gallente and Caldari (gallente cuisine dominates Jita 4-4..etc.)
- Folks who don't RP sociopathic, immortal and powermad capsuleers are simply capsuleers who haven't grasped their destiny yet.
- Capsuleers do indeed hang out in their own establishments, although this one is a secret one....
And a whole bunch of other stuff...requires re-reading
GO READ!
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Well, to me the information that was in the chron was pretty much pointless.
It was a bit meh, with a bit of blechh.
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Interesting.
I feel like it might have shot softclones in the foot a wee bit, but its interesting.
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Interesting.
I feel like it might have shot softclones in the foot a wee bit, but its interesting.
"... take a hit contract on some civilian in the crosshairs of a person with too much money and some serious grudges. Just walk up to them as they amble tiredly towards a shuttle and then boom, spray, bang, zap...who knows, but it's lights out either way and I'm laughing all the way to the nearest clone bank."
I read that as capsuleers being used as suicide assassins. Maybe that's just me. The capsuleer would make some extra cash, and wouldn't even know about the hit - perfect deniable asset.
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I really enjoyed this one, actually.
A lot of the chrons focus on aspects of New Eden that don't really affect my character, although they do paint the the world for the purposes of RP...
But this focused on the "destiny" of the capsuleer, which is something that's actually bugged me plenty in the past. There are a lot of fine lines to walk, between the meaning "immortal" as we use it and the mortality of the capsuleer, and just how "normal" a capsuleer can be considering their lifestyle. Not to mention, the thought of the brain being turned into data sparked my interest like none other.
I suppose this is a bad chron to read for people still playing their eggers like Sims. >>
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I feel like it might have shot softclones in the foot a wee bit, but its interesting.
I agree with Horatius. I actually thought that it suggested that podders killed outside the pod could still wake up in a clone bay - also the bit about corporate suits waking up in a clone bay after their bodyguards had failed.
The mechanics haven't been explained very well, but the hint is strong that it's possible.
And I agree completely about podders being most vulnerable in their clone bays...
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Idk, on one hand it hinted that you could clone out of a pod, on the other hand it hinted that you can't clone out of a pod.
On the gripping hand, people will handwave it in their favor regardless, so not really worth stressing over.
pretty good overall, plugs, drugs, and b-lining, pretty awesome.
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Interesting.
I feel like it might have shot softclones in the foot a wee bit, but its interesting.
"... take a hit contract on some civilian in the crosshairs of a person with too much money and some serious grudges. Just walk up to them as they amble tiredly towards a shuttle and then boom, spray, bang, zap...who knows, but it's lights out either way and I'm laughing all the way to the nearest clone bank."
I read that as capsuleers being used as suicide assassins. Maybe that's just me. The capsuleer would make some extra cash, and wouldn't even know about the hit - perfect deniable asset.
Agreed 100%. I laughed, and thanked whomsoever wrote this for C3. I've been looking for an excuse to why some memories might be selective and possibly faked, now I was basicly landed an excuse right in my lap. It is possible.
The Jita 4-4's food is run by Gallente food markets (in your face Heth, ha ha ha ha ha, worthless noob.) was hillarious too. Pretentions, can be so cruel. I'm loving this, laughed so hard to the implied 'ticking-bomb' approach on Capsuleers. "Who knows why he's here, might as well shoot him to be sure." - that BTW along with the time-bomb thing perfectly underlined soft-clones btw, end of discussion once and for all.
Work of utter epicness, created with an ample supply of win and awesomeness. Easily one of the best, if not the best, cronicle besides the short-stories.
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Holy sh--
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in your face Heth, ha ha ha ha ha, worthless noob.
:roll:
Edit: I enjoyed the Chronicle.
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That fucking rocked. :D
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In the thread: people taking an obviously unreliable first person narrator as gospel.
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in your face Heth, ha ha ha ha ha, worthless noob.
:roll:
Edit: I enjoyed the Chronicle.
Glad you actually DID enjoy the cron.
Regardless, the Caldari trade center number 1 is a good example of inter-Empire influence going fine. Heth had, among other things, a blocking of all Federal influence as one of his goals - and he seems to be doing very poorly. I found that to be hillarious - about as hillarious as the fact that State/Federation dealings still goes rather fine desite of the war. Was it not a Gallente idea to minimize that, iirc?
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Regardless, the Caldari trade center number 1 is a good example of inter-Empire influence going fine. Heth had, among other things, a blocking of all Federal influence as one of his goals - and he seems to be doing very poorly.
And the chronicle talks about the challenges of doing just that. It is like trying to stop Coke and McDonalds from selling their product Bejing because of they are stalwarts of American capitalism. It talks about how you have cute Civire girls serving Matari/Amarr fusion dishes made by Gallente chefs. It is like going to Vegas ordering from the cute blonde from Texas with a Frenchman in back making you his Korean Tacos.
I found that to be hillarious - about as hillarious as the fact that State/Federation dealings still goes rather fine desite of the war. Was it not a Gallente idea to minimize that, iirc?
Its Jita, NoH, SuVee, Quafe, and whoever else owns the food chain restaurants are going to pay to have some decent chefs in the field to work the cluster's trade hub food court. As for the State/Federation business, NoH, CBD, KK, Ishukone, and Wirykomi all have stations in Fed high-sec; continuing trade through these veins is required for their continued survival as competitive entities.
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But this focused on the "destiny" of the capsuleer
For this little gem, this is chron is far more important than other infodumps.....it tells the story of "one of us"....
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In the thread: people taking an obviously unreliable first person narrator as gospel.
Yes, I did notice that, and there are areas where we'd need to factor that in. But that doesn't mean the whole thing should be viewed as "oh it was just a dream". It means we need to pay attention to detail, that's all. :)
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First, great chron.
Second, about the soft clone issue, I would say this proves that it is possible, just expensive. The key is in the last few lines I think. For the moment of podding, the capulseer exists only as data. And the thing about data is that it is static. Therefore, it can be saved. So, even if you want to buy into the idea that a brain scan destroys the brain (which I think is menctioned in a chron someplace), all you have to do is pod yourself, and then save the data that comes in. Easy enough if you have money to bribe the techs, or have your own clone bay. Then, go out and get killed if you have too, and when you are confirmed dead, whoever is working for you brings out your clone, uploads the saved data, and you are left mildly confused, and possibably much much richer.
Third, I think most of this is meant as an incarna teaser. They already hinted at it in the incarna trailers with some things you need to get done in person, off the record.
Fourth, I think there is a clue to the sleeper mistery in here, as well as what we might be doing in Incarna. I haven't hread anything about this C3 drug, so I will assume that it is not on the market as a drug. The chron menctions what if we never came back to a body. And this C3 drug can compartimalize our minds. So, let us follow a possible trail for this capulseer backwards to the rim where she came from. Let us say 0.0 space. Maybe she has a supercarrier or Titan she flies. But think, she doesn't need all the information about piloting and shield operations to go on a trip like this, probably doesn't even need anything she learned in pod pilot school if she just takes shuttles to Jita, and it sounds like she doesn't have a ship there. So, using this drug, she stored all that data, and hopped out of her pod in the equivalent of an alpha clone. That one clone can store our life story before we became capsulers, I doubt a few more years would strain it. And she goes off to Jita, knowing that if something does happen, so can just reclone, and then plug her skills back in. And since this is the only body wandering around, there are not multiple clones, which are against the law. Of course, what do we care for laws?
But here is the interesting part. Those skills she leaves behind in her ship. Would it just sit there, or could it run the ship while the body was gone. Without a human drive, it might be a robot, but a very well skilled robot, with knowledge of every fleet engagement, every skirmish the pilot had ever been in. There are theories that the sleepers did something like this, becoming the data that runs their ships. Maybe we are about to do the same.
Anyway, my take on this stuff. However CCP plays it, it is a good story.
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I think most of this is meant as an incarna teaser. They already hinted at it in the incarna trailers with some things you need to get done in person, off the record.
That's exactly what I thought when I read it.
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http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/C3-FTM_Acid
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I liked it.
It meandered a bit near the middle, but still, full of great info.
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I liked it.
It meandered a bit near the middle, but still, full of great info.
I thought that too, it was very stream of consciousness, drifting thoughts that didn't quite flow as well as they should have.
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Finally read it, and well. Shit hot.
Edit: Someone needs to go through and tease all of the snippets of direct PF info out of there, too. Foods and animals and things. :D
Unreliable narrators or not, there is some stuff in there that it is probably safe to say is usable.
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Edit: Someone needs to go through and tease all of the snippets of direct PF info out of there, too. Foods and animals and things. :D
I will be incorporating the Gallente/Caldari stuff into an update to my Fed guide at some point.
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Two thumbs up... very enjoyable =D
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For the moment of podding, the capulseer exists only as data. And the thing about data is that it is static. Therefore, it can be saved.
This is a bit off topic but shoot, I haven't had my brekkies yet.
At the moment of podding the information that is scanned from your brain is already in the clone.
The whole thing works with the fluid router pairs that react to things across unimaginable distances simultaneuosly. There is no space between the scan and the burning, they happen at the same time.
At least in regular PC situation.
Therefore there is no infomorph.
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For the moment of podding, the capulseer exists only as data. And the thing about data is that it is static. Therefore, it can be saved.
This is a bit off topic but shoot, I haven't had my brekkies yet.
At the moment of podding the information that is scanned from your brain is already in the clone.
The whole thing works with the fluid router pairs that react to things across unimaginable distances simultaneuosly. There is no space between the scan and the burning, they happen at the same time.
At least in regular PC situation.
Therefore there is no infomorph.
The pod-end fluid router is not the scanner, the vat-end fluid router is not the writer. There has to be an electronic transmission between the scanning equipment and the transmission system, and from the transmission system into the fresh clone.
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The cranium is constructed by seeding this gel structure (heavily impregnated with nutrients and inactivated growth factors) with nerve cells and glia, in accordance with information from the brain scan. Bound to the growth factors are molecular receptors that are coupled (using the well known FTL-communication technology) to molecules placed in the customer's burning scanner. After seeding, the gel structure is suspended until the final moment of the original. As the burning scan is made, the molecules bound to the inactivated growth factors become unstable and cause activation of the growth factors by cleavage. The activation is an exothermic process which produces sufficient heat to melt pathways into the gel model of the brain. Thus dendrite paths in the model will be the same as in the original's brain, their growth fuelled by the activated growth factors
Fluid routers work with molecule pairs that resonate at the same time.
Something happens to the other, then something happens to the other.
The fluid routers in the pod that are connected to your burning scanner are directly connected to the ones that are in the gel that forms your brain in the clone.
There is no transmissions involved that could be copied.
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Well, you'd have to take it up with Dropbear. I mean, according to current physics, you can't use quantum entanglement to communicate information at all. I kinda figure, their made-up communication system, their rules.
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Whether or not the transmissions could be copied, per se, quantum communication still involves data. Our current understanding makes eavesdropping on this data difficult (think Heisenberg). The trick with any security system, including quantum crypto, usually lies in the implementation rather than the theory -- data gets leaked all over the place, which is where most crypto attacks "in the wild" occur.
In theory, theory and practice are identical, but in practice, they're totally different.
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:bash:
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There is, in PF, one example of things that I am aware of.
[spoiler]In the Amarr Epic arc, Sansha-branch.[/spoiler] There is a stored brain pattern that is required for a plot.
It is from someone executed by brain-scanner using the same technology as the capsule. The purpose was to execute the person while retaining their personality for study by criminologists and psychologists.
Anyway, the pattern being stored, means it could be copied, and implemented again and again, yes/no?
Also allows for interesting possibilities regarding rehabilitation of criminals.
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Also, the Zainou biotech dude uploaded his brain to a computer, right?
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Also, the Zainou biotech dude uploaded his brain to a computer, right?
Yep.
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Yes, but I thought that was by a totally different set of processes compared to the capsule?
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Yes, but I thought that was by a totally different set of processes compared to the capsule?
Don't think it has ever been explored at all, which is a shame.
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Maybe I read into this differently from everyone else, but I intensely disliked Jita 4-4. Really, I find the "capsuleers are arrested or shot on sight" thing to completely break my QER. I just can't believe it. I think it's bad storytelling.
If capsuleers are such dangerous loose cannons, why does the rest of the galaxy put up with them? I mean, there are violent upheavals and revolutions in this galaxy over less. The Intaki are up in arms just because they don't like federal bureacracy, so it is really hard to believe people aren't doing anything about the capsuleers (if they're really this bad).
And if being a capsuleer leads to being some cruel, aloof demigod, why do governments keep investing in them? Given how feared, hated, and most of all expensive capsuleers are, one would think the empires would simply try and eliminate them all or at least stop making more.
I can see eggers being some scary, alien "caste," but arrested? Shot? That shows a level of hostility not shown anywhere else in the game world. I mean, if they'd shoot me for getting food in a Jita food court, why don't they shoot me when I'm 1v1ing outside the station, possibly killing thousands? The disparity here doesn't make sense.
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I can see eggers being some scary, alien "caste," but arrested? Shot? That shows a level of hostility not shown anywhere else in the game world. I mean, if they'd shoot me for getting food in a Jita food court, why don't they shoot me when I'm pew pewing outside the station, possibly killing thousands? The disparity here doesn't make sense.
Well, it's a lot easier to shoot a capsuleer when he's not going all elite demigod on your fleet's pathetic ass. Plus, out of pod, he's dead-dead, not just annoyed. Perhaps more relevantly, this particular capsuleer lacks an ID badge that everyone is supposed to have. He's pretending to be a baseline and hasn't, I think, announced his presence officially. I think the gist is that, if you're a capsuleer and you're somewhere you're not supposed to be and they find out, then Jita 4-4's policy is just to ice you, because it's easier and less painful in the long run. I'm not sure this policy should be generalized to include all capsuleers in all places.
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I'm not sure this policy should be generalized to include all capsuleers in all places.
I should have thought of this....
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I can see eggers being some scary, alien "caste," but arrested? Shot? That shows a level of hostility not shown anywhere else in the game world. I mean, if they'd shoot me for getting food in a Jita food court, why don't they shoot me when I'm pew pewing outside the station, possibly killing thousands? The disparity here doesn't make sense.
Plus, out of pod, he's dead-dead, not just annoyed.
not so sure, there seem to be bits that imply this isn't the case from the chronicle, although I'm not sure, it seems to both argue for and against softclones at the same time.
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And if being a capsuleer leads to being some cruel, aloof demigod, why do governments keep investing in them? Given how feared, hated, and most of all expensive capsuleers are, one would think the empires would simply try and eliminate them all or at least stop making more.
I can see eggers being some scary, alien "caste," but arrested? Shot? That shows a level of hostility not shown anywhere else in the game world. I mean, if they'd shoot me for getting food in a Jita food court, why don't they shoot me when I'm 1v1ing outside the station, possibly killing thousands? The disparity here doesn't make sense.
This could be an unfolding development. I mean, capsuleers weren't around before seven years ago, outside of NPCs that existed in the canon. The Eve cluster has had seven years of our predations to suffer since the game went live, so speaking storywise they could simply be growing sick of us. A lot of those baseline people could be itching for a crack at revenge upon a capsuleer, plotting to catch him out of pod.
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Where's Aria Jenneth and the Exodus Project when we need them?
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A lot of those baseline people could be itching for a crack at revenge upon a capsuleer, plotting to catch him out of pod.
Which could be an interesting short story. I am picturing a crime scene and a capsuleer drowned in a public toilet.
Along those lines, when I have portrayed my characters as being out-of-pod, they are surrounded by a security detail. Granted personal protection is not the only reason for a LDPS security team to be escorting Dex when he isn't in pod.
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Yes, but I thought that was by a totally different set of processes compared to the capsule?
Don't think it has ever been explored at all, which is a shame.
You could argue that Zainou's research interests have in fact been explored, just not in a very overt way. Consider Hilen Tukoss.
Who does he work for? Zainou.
Why did they have him following a CreoDron physicist into Sleeper space? That little-known sentence about minds into machines could be the beginning of the answer there.
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Along those lines, when I have portrayed my characters as being out-of-pod, they are surrounded by a security detail.
I typically do this as well, at least once I got past some of the over-the-top capabilities I first imagined.