Backstage - OOC Forums
EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => CCP Public Library => Topic started by: Ghost Hunter on 20 Dec 2010, 11:49
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http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=20-12-10
Well well well
Edit; Having read the chronicle now.
I find it interesting they went with the ME2 Collectors method of people harvesting, but it is suitably within the theme of the Sansha since the people are fully aware of what are happening to them. I thought something like this would happen (lol burning life), but heyo.
This chronicle pleases me. They are still quite willingly walking into our dropships.
Also about to check the eve forums, I'm willing to bet someone suddenly has a revelation of what happens now.
Edit 2; Oh good lord are those Sansha suits in the background with the people, I wants them :O
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This chronicle pleases me. They are still quite willingly walking into our dropships.
And I quote:
Before the victims below could understand what was happening, the nanites had already passed through the outer layer of skin, navigated the bloodstream, and attached themselves to the base of their spinal cords. When enough of the insidious little things had amassed in a single person, they begin to emit rhythmic electrical pulses ― not enough to disrupt higher brain functions, but more than enough to overpower the simple neural pathways below the neck. People screamed and shouted, struggled in vain, and cried pitifully for help, but their bodies wouldn’t respond. They walked out into the green tinted glare of wide-angle tractor beams, which lifted them off the ground by the thousands. Their bodies tumbled slowly, out of control, up into the waiting dropships.
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This chronicle pleases me. They are still quite willingly walking into our dropships.
And I quote:
Before the victims below could understand what was happening, the nanites had already passed through the outer layer of skin, navigated the bloodstream, and attached themselves to the base of their spinal cords. When enough of the insidious little things had amassed in a single person, they begin to emit rhythmic electrical pulses ― not enough to disrupt higher brain functions, but more than enough to overpower the simple neural pathways below the neck. People screamed and shouted, struggled in vain, and cried pitifully for help, but their bodies wouldn’t respond. They walked out into the green tinted glare of wide-angle tractor beams, which lifted them off the ground by the thousands. Their bodies tumbled slowly, out of control, up into the waiting dropships.
I don't think you quite understood what I meant by that.
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Nobody understands ghostie.
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They are walking into position to be tractorbeamed.
Not being carried by the Sansha Troopers.
Therefore (low-resolution) video footage would show people apparently walking un-coerced.
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The body's willing but the mind says no. :P
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PREPARE THESE HUMANS FOR
ASCENSCION UPLIFTING. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCP0keNMB3w&feature=BF&list=PL2F92D554CB1FC3C0&index=5)
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Well, I thought it was pretty clear what was happening. The parasites hijack their motor functions, even if they try to resist mentally. It goes back to what The Plague Years said about True Slaves realizing what they are but having no way to help themselves.
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I knew it but nobody ever listens to me ;)
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Yup, still taking unwilling people as slaves as far as Borza is concerned. Even if he doesn't have that specific info IC there are anti-amarr/slavery zealots known to him who had been taken, obviously not something they'd choose.
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I like how this sheds new light into that "liberty pill" issue we had on Solitude.
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I like how this sheds new light into that "liberty pill" issue we had on Solitude.
Yeah I'm just waiting for people to now suggest that civilians lock themselves in rooms and take muscle relaxants/anesthetics when they learn of an incoming Sansha attack.
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I wonder what happens if somebody els starts hacking the concord networks and stumbles across embedded sansha attack code.
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Yep, Sansha = Collectors, apparently.
[spoiler]If Inhonores doesn't show up soon... there won't be a cluster left to save.[/spoiler]
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Well, I thought it was pretty clear what was happening. The parasites hijack their motor functions, even if they try to resist mentally. It goes back to what The Plague Years said about True Slaves realizing what they are but having no way to help themselves.
Imagine the mental suffering true slaves endure when faced with their loved ones as drone or during a incursion. I wonder what it would do to a mind and how they deal with remorse and other such feelings.
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We've been making the ME jokes for half a year now. -_-
now we'll never be able to escape them!
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the ME jokes
They are the vanguard of our destruction.
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"I found one day in school a boy of medium size ill-treating a smaller boy. I expostulated, but he replied: 'The bigs hit me, so I hit the babies; that's fair.' In these words he epitomized the history of the human race."
Education and the Social Order
- Bertrand Russell
"#Sansha We're giving back the dream."
-twitter.com/citizenastur
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the ME jokes
They are the vanguard of our destruction.
THIS IS TRUE POWER
*ahem*
On a constructive note, at least they finally gave us an explanation for the Empire forces being practically inert. It still feels like an ass pull (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Asspull) but it's more plausible than claiming an entire system's worth of naval ships/regional fleets are focusing on just the drop ships.
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I Almost feel like this chronicle is done in response to that thread about why the navy isn't responding.
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
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This chronicle pleases me. They are still quite willingly walking into our dropships.
And I quote:
Before the victims below could understand what was happening, the nanites had already passed through the outer layer of skin, navigated the bloodstream, and attached themselves to the base of their spinal cords. When enough of the insidious little things had amassed in a single person, they begin to emit rhythmic electrical pulses ― not enough to disrupt higher brain functions, but more than enough to overpower the simple neural pathways below the neck. People screamed and shouted, struggled in vain, and cried pitifully for help, but their bodies wouldn’t respond. They walked out into the green tinted glare of wide-angle tractor beams, which lifted them off the ground by the thousands. Their bodies tumbled slowly, out of control, up into the waiting dropships.
I don't think you quite understood what I meant by that.
I usually don't understand what happens with Sansha stuff, which is why I usually keep my hands off of it, but this time I wanted to be glib about it like the cool kids.
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This chronicle pleases me. They are still quite willingly walking into our dropships.
And I quote:
Before the victims below could understand what was happening, the nanites had already passed through the outer layer of skin, navigated the bloodstream, and attached themselves to the base of their spinal cords. When enough of the insidious little things had amassed in a single person, they begin to emit rhythmic electrical pulses ― not enough to disrupt higher brain functions, but more than enough to overpower the simple neural pathways below the neck. People screamed and shouted, struggled in vain, and cried pitifully for help, but their bodies wouldn’t respond. They walked out into the green tinted glare of wide-angle tractor beams, which lifted them off the ground by the thousands. Their bodies tumbled slowly, out of control, up into the waiting dropships.
I don't think you quite understood what I meant by that.
They are going willingly. It's just not their will that is involved.
I would mantain that this takes the nice Sansha saviours of humanity notion and shoots it in the head. With a howitzer.
Most of New Eden is grey. But there is still horror in there. The Sansha, the Rogue Drones and possibly the ultimate fate of the Jove come to mind as the best examples of this.
And, of course, the comedy elements like the EoM.
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Most of New Eden is grey.
I would beg to differ. I would say there are many colors, many shades, and grey morality does not constitute a "grey" universe. Still...
But there is still horror in there. The Sansha, the Rogue Drones and possibly the ultimate fate of the Jove come to mind as the best examples of this.
...there isn't always a happy (http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=29-11-10) ending. As for the Rogue Drones, I don't think the full picture regarding them has been fully revealed.
Nation? You can deny the nature of the beast all you want, but that does not make it any less hungry, and you any less appetizing. ;)
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Rogue drones are an entirely different sort of horror altogether, and one I'd like to explore further in the near future.
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Okay, before anyone says anything anywhere at any time.
I'm aware there's practically no bloodless hand in EVE, and the clean ones certainly don't belong to the empires or rogue factions or anything like that. I'm also fully aware why Sansha loyalist players still stick to their faction, and why I don't have a right to infringe on that.
What I am saying is, I think I agree with Arnulf. This is the last nail in the coffin for the "peaceful" theories. Still, no reason to suddenly drop all interest in Sansha, or for the Sansha pilots to give up their work.
... ffs, why am I still contributing, I don't even like this story arc! ><
I'm getting some damn pizza...
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Of course, offering my opinion is largely redundant and open to general ridicule from the greater community, however, I agree with Senn's points.
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Kinda lame, but at least there's an explanation. It only took a few months. :|
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A nice enough read, in spite of the as mentioned Collector-esque theme. Ha, well.
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
So, Ze'ev? Make with the creation of a Seeker swarm Sansha bug antidote.
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Ghost is the Harbinger of our Ascension \o/
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Rogue drones are an entirely different sort of horror altogether, and one I'd like to explore further in the near future.
I wrote a story about that! :D
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
So, Ze'ev? Make with the creation of a Seeker swarm Sansha bug antidote.
The cure will be worse than the disease, I can tell you that right now. Besides, I've got my hands full with Kyonoke.
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
So, Ze'ev? Make with the creation of a Seeker swarm Sansha bug antidote.
Pfft, like I said. People just need to hide and take muscle relaxants. Messy. Smelly. But probably effective.
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People just need to hide and take muscle relaxants. Messy. Smelly. But probably effective.
I think you just outlined a new religion.
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
So, Ze'ev? Make with the creation of a Seeker swarm Sansha bug antidote.
Barring blantantly metagaming (which we will no doubt see in the IGS), I don't think he can seek research for a treatment towards something that isn't knowledge to everyone yet. I believe we simply have to RAFO.
Shame I haven't played Mass Effect 2 yet, to be able to get all the jokes said. While this certainly paints more in detail to what makes Nation horrifying, I'm curious when we will get to read more of the humanized parts to it and all the hints surrounding it to why being a supporter has validity to it.
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I'm curious when we will get to read more of the humanized parts to it and all the hints surrounding it to why being a supporter has validity to it.
Sadly, that looks less and less likely to happen, Arvo. At least on CCP's part, imo, given the depictions in "The Plague Years" and now "Uplifted".
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I can think of a few angles for a supporter to take. "Those chosen must undergo a brief period of discomfort in exchange for their uplifting, much as a patient receives an injection to cure a disease." Or somesuch.
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Well, yea. I still think they're trending toward "Sansha are evil and Kuvakei's an ubermadman, so just deal with it". I see these two competing views:
Sansha? Yea, they're gonna punch through your face with superECM and nanites that take over your motor functions! Then they're gonna suck you up into a drop ship with a tractor beam! And if you don't come with them? They'll turn your family into mindless drones and send them to murder you! Ughhhhh!! SANSHA -- it's got electrolytes! ::pheer::
vs.
Sansha? Oh, they're more powerful than you think. Feel that soft caress down your spine? The hair standing up on your neck? That's their carefully dispersed memetic virus slowly insinuating itself into your world view and making you want to give yourself over to them. You love Nation, don't you? Yes. You just... never realized it... somehow, until this moment. Welcome, my child.
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Do not try to RP Sansha as good guys using your OOG/OOC morality, or the general, accepted moral code on the Internet. It will NOT work.
Instead, you have to adopt a Citizen Astur "extreme means to an end" approach. Nation ARE the good guys, but only if you adopt that morality, and don't try to use your OOC sensibilities. Jia-Lei Lian RPs as such; they're not actually that crazy IRL I imagine :P
It is roleplaying after all. IC, you RP them as the good guys, but OOC you are aware of these pitfalls.
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they're not actually that crazy IRL I imagine
Oh? :3
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Do not try to RP Sansha as good guys using your OOG/OOC morality, or the general, accepted moral code on the Internet. It will NOT work.
Instead, you have to adopt a Citizen Astur "extreme means to an end" approach. Nation ARE the good guys, but only if you adopt that morality, and don't try to use your OOC sensibilities. Jia-Lei Lian RPs as such; they're not actually that crazy IRL I imagine :P
It is roleplaying after all. IC, you RP them as the good guys, but OOC you are aware of these pitfalls.
I concur.
Don't get me wrong I'm happy that people are choosing to play Sansha loyalists and/or stooges. I think that it should be easier for them to express that properly.
However this is an OOC conversation and OOC there is no upside to the Sansha.
Most of the other human factions can be shown to be sympathetic in one way or another. The Sansha are tools of a madman that would put the average Bond villian to shame. Somehow I doubt life inside the faction has any of the moments of love and humanity that even the Blooders are shown to be capable of (in The Burning Life).
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Barring blantantly metagaming (which we will no doubt see in the IGS), I don't think he can seek research for a treatment towards something that isn't knowledge to everyone yet. I believe we simply have to RAFO.
I see no reason why a competant capsuleer investigating the groundside operations over the last few months would be unable to have gathered the information that was presented in the chronicle. I would agree that anyone suddenly claiming they have a cure/countermeasure is full of shit, but the nature of the uplifitings is hardly a secret on the level of LolJamyl.
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Do not try to RP Sansha as good guys using your OOG/OOC morality, or the general, accepted moral code on the Internet. It will NOT work.
Instead, you have to adopt a Citizen Astur "extreme means to an end" approach. Nation ARE the good guys, but only if you adopt that morality, and don't try to use your OOC sensibilities. Jia-Lei Lian RPs as such; they're not actually that crazy IRL I imagine :P
It is roleplaying after all. IC, you RP them as the good guys, but OOC you are aware of these pitfalls.
Very well said. :3
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There are other angles on it, too, ofc.
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Okay, so I loved the Chron in terms of what it is... letting us know OOC what is going on, and how the Sansha are pulling their shenanigans. As well as the way it shows the Nation for exactly what they are.
However, and this is the frustrating part, I am absolutely irate for the exact same reasons. IC there's no evidence of what's causing people to walk to the "pickup zones", even after extensive research of the incursion sites there's nothing that has been picked up to indicate nanite clouds controlling people's motor functions, no signs of drugs in the water, no signs of propaganda-esque material laying around to convince them, no signs of anything except missing people. And unfortunately, because of this amazingly written chron, people will have sudden "EUREKA! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eureka_(word))" moments figuring this information out without a feasible source for the information.
It boils down to the IC/OOC information divide and how people are going to approach it. IC, Inara doesn't know this, and won't unless there's a reliable source of intel IC that comes about. Which is frustrating, because if they happen to hit a certain planet... it would be really nice if she was aware of this, and could be prepared (or working on preparations) for the eventuality. OOC, I'm now aware of how it happens and think it's rather ingenious (while being evil and twisted), and could think of several "solutions" to the problem.
Do not try to RP Sansha Your Faction (or lack of Faction) of Choice as good guys using your OOG/OOC morality, or the general, accepted moral code on the Internet. It will NOT work.
*snip*
It is roleplaying after all. IC, you RP them as the good guys, but OOC you are aware of these pitfalls.
Edit/emphasis mine, because I think it's something that needs to be remembered and applied to everyone. I have a character who is an Empire Loyalist, when I'm on that one... the Empire is right, God and the Empress' will must be carried out, etc. OOC, I know the Empire has quite a few problems that need to be looked into. On Inara, the Cartel is the ideal society, taking the best of the cluster and improving on it to make Heaven even greater than the "Big 4" combined. OOC, I could tell you a dozen things they do to achieve their goals that would curl your nosehair (but I won't, simply due to many people not being able to separate IC/OOC information).
Summary: I love information about EVE, and hope it never stops coming. But, I hate information about EVE that is useful but unobtainable via reasonable IC measures that will be dragged into the IC realm by people who don't have the same views of reasonable attainability.
Oh, and the Chron was great.
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How I would know (some) stuff IC.
Louella has been at several incursions. Louella threw some mines out, and mentioned this to the Navy + CONCORD dudes that were present. These mines would have interfered with and/or damaged some of the returning dropships.
Chronicle mentions "Stray weapons fire from both sides caused more than a few of them to explode, get knocked hopelessly off course, or suffer hull breaches, sending thousands of paralyzed humans spiraling out into space."
After-action salvage + retrieval by the Navy/CONCORD/private corporations would find some of these crippled dropships or wrecks thereof, and the bodies of the unfortunate.
Post-Mortem examination and analysis would (erroneously) suggest the nanites act as a paralysing agent, allowing the people to be manhandled (or true-slavehandled) onto the dropships easily. Or as a thing for causing relaxation during the extreme accelerations involved in space travel - tensed bodies get injured more often than relaxed ones, that sort of thing. No indications/evidence of Teh Horror!!, unless survivors on an intact ship are found.
Lou would hear some of this from gossip and/or trade magazines related to "Rescuing People From Space" - of which some npc corporations exist, as mentioned in a previous chronicle - "Lost Stars".
The rest of it, I don't see how I would know about it.
I could write something on IGS if people want.
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When haeldone gave the briefing about how the communications of a system went down, I joked about how much it was like the horizon mission briefing.
And yep. there we go.
So, Ze'ev? Make with the creation of a Seeker swarm Sansha bug antidote.
The cure will be worse than the disease, I can tell you that right now. Besides, I've got my hands full with Kyonoke.
Do you have any I could borrow? Always wanted some Kyonoke.
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Get away for the Kyonoke Istvaan. You've been obsessed with the stuff for months. D:
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Do not try to RP Sansha as good guys using your OOG/OOC morality, or the general, accepted moral code on the Internet. It will NOT work.
Instead, you have to adopt a Citizen Astur "extreme means to an end" approach. Nation ARE the good guys, but only if you adopt that morality, and don't try to use your OOC sensibilities. Jia-Lei Lian RPs as such; they're not actually that crazy IRL I imagine :P
It is roleplaying after all. IC, you RP them as the good guys, but OOC you are aware of these pitfalls.
I concur.
Don't get me wrong I'm happy that people are choosing to play Sansha loyalists and/or stooges. I think that it should be easier for them to express that properly.
However this is an OOC conversation and OOC there is no upside to the Sansha.
Most of the other human factions can be shown to be sympathetic in one way or another. The Sansha are tools of a madman that would put the average Bond villian to shame. Somehow I doubt life inside the faction has any of the moments of love and humanity that even the Blooders are shown to be capable of (in The Burning Life).
I am getting a little tired of the "your RP is wrong" and the "this is OOC, dont try justify yourself here" crowd.
^^ Not intending to point to anyone in particular, because thats certainly not all of them.
EDITED TO ADD: Comments like these are the reasons I stay out of any Sansha RP with anyone, even though my character is a Sansha loyalist living in Stain who should have some interest in whats been going on.
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How could capsuleers know about this stuff?
By now victims must have been recovered and analysed. Unless the nanites self-destruct on the death of the host their presence is now known about by governments. Even if they normally do self destructs have been known to malfunction.
Civillian suveillance networks would probably be knocked out by the initial EMP burst and/or compromised by Sansha cracking. However who is to say an intelligence agency hasn't thought to leave a hardened, autonomous recorder around to see people walking out into the tractor beams, and capture the agonised expressions as they do so.
Anyone with decent government, military, intelligence or media connections could therefore have heard about this information. Yes, governments might try to keep this quiet to prevent more panic but that can't work forever. Stuff like this would leak eventually.
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Especially to capsuleers that work heavily with intelligence and security services... Hmm.
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I concur.
Don't get me wrong I'm happy that people are choosing to play Sansha loyalists and/or stooges. I think that it should be easier for them to express that properly.
However this is an OOC conversation and OOC there is no upside to the Sansha.
Most of the other human factions can be shown to be sympathetic in one way or another. The Sansha are tools of a madman that would put the average Bond villian to shame. Somehow I doubt life inside the faction has any of the moments of love and humanity that even the Blooders are shown to be capable of (in The Burning Life).
I am getting a little tired of the "your RP is wrong" and the "this is OOC, dont try justify yourself here" crowd.
^^ Not intending to point to anyone in particular, because thats certainly not all of them.
EDITED TO ADD: Comments like these are the reasons I stay out of any Sansha RP with anyone, even though my character is a Sansha loyalist living in Stain who should have some interest in whats been going on.
OK. I'm confused. Comments like these put you off Sansha RP but you aren't pointing at anyone.
And how, exactly is this "your RP is wrong"? I'm just stating an opinion about a bunch of NPC's based on my reading of what CCP has published about them. How does this invalidate your RP?
If you think I'm wrong then by all means try to convince me otherwise. It's only a game after all. I won't mind.
You could, for example, point me at this:http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=1533.0 (http://backstage.eve-inspiracy.com/index.php?topic=1533.0)
I'm not sure PF makes this likely but I could see the argument.
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It's not a case of "Your RP is wrong".
For example, public execution is commonplace in the Federation apparently. Seriphyn would have grown up as a Gallentean with this in mind, and thus he doesn't see anything wrong with it. IRL, I am opposed to execution, and think public execution is deplorable. The same way I would OOG disagree with the sometimes aggressive, abrasive and immature behaviour of Seriphyn, but still RP it.
There is just nothing redeeming, from an OOC moral perspective, about sending nanite swarms down to planets, kidnapping millions to turn them into unwilling slaves with their mind screaming for escape. However, this doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't RP it. We're capsuleers and murder in the hundreds each day. You just simply adopt an attitude for your character; fictionally, there is absolutely nothing wrong with believing that a post-human state like Sansha's Nation that brings a complete end to conflict and strife is the best solution. The True Slaves is simply the price you have to pay for peace and complete unity amongst humanity.
Same way that, if people opt to sympathize with Seriphyn and study his character, he's a big emotional coward, and would not do half the things he has done OOC.