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General Discussion => The Speakeasy: OOG/Off-topic Discussion => Topic started by: Katrina Oniseki on 29 Jun 2013, 06:31
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(http://pinkbluelovescute.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/Mother-cat-with-her-kittens.jpeg)
Alright, surprise surprise, Kat has kids! Little Kat Kittens. Kat Kits. :D :cube:
7 year old and 4 year old, both girls. After fighting a legal battle for several years, I finally won biweekly visitation with both of them. They're super excited to visit as often as they can. So, here's the deal. I kinda live in the middle of nowhere, and I also happen to be very low income (< $25,000/yr).
So far, I've done a bunch of things for them, such as build a swing, take them t a free train museum, make cookies and cakes together, play with blocks and legos, summer sprinkler fun, reading books together, etc. However, short of video games and movies, I'm running out of things to do they haven't done before. Maybe that's where you come in? What other sorts of activities can I do that would help raise the girls well?
Also, I have a few questions about the youngest being afraid of the dark. Sleeping in a new house (with her older sister), she tends to wake up in the night crying and calling for her mother (who isn't here). I've set up a nightlight in the room, but short of sleeping with me, how can I help this? What sorts of foods other than sugars should I avoid to help prevent nightmares?
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Hello Kat,
first, I'd like to say that I respect you a lot for fighting for your right to see your children. I've been the child of divorced parents myself and I think it's very important for the kids to have both their father and mother around, if alone to let them feel that they haven't been a reason for the divorce.
You even more have my respect for how much thought you put into caring for your girls. And while I don't think that video games and movies are such a bad thing every now and then, I'd suggest to you that you should have little fear of doing something that you have already done. I can say for sure that whenever I visited my father, what I enjoyed most was going out for a walk in the forests with him and we did it a lot. (And it is to this day one of the activities I enjoy most with him!) It's also the most memorable thing we did, because my father enjoyed it as much as I did, it was something we could share in, regularly, and that only strengthened our bonds.
So, naturally I'd suggest you could simply go out with your girls, watch the birds, insects and stuff, if you feel like, take a nature guide with you, try to identify what you've seen or do so once you're back. Make sure that your little girl doesn't have to walk too far. ^,^ Other than that, let them share in what you like to do and if you have the feeling they like it as well, build on that!
In regard to sleep, I can recommend warm milk with honey before going to bed, it helps sleeping soundly! Also, maybe you'd want to ask your girl why she's afraid of the dark and go monster hunting for her or whatever! All in all I'd recommend that you take action to make her feel comfy at night at your place as well, rather than going for the reaction route - and the night light was a really good idea there!
I wish you and your children all the best!
Nico
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Hiyas Kat!
Well done also! I can't really recommend more. What about art projects? Painting or making things with clay? Nature walks? Building forts?
As for the nighttime thing, let her sleep with you if it gives her comfort. It's not developing bad habits, but instead you are reassuring her that you are there for her emotional needs. Constant reassurance. It's all new for her.
If you need any other advice, you can message me in game. :-)
Lasa
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Nice ideas, especially on the nature walks. I'm not entirely a nature person, but there's lots of forests and farms around where I live! I might try and do some scouting and see what areas would be good for a walk. Maybe some local or state reserves and trails. The older one wants to go see some of the horses that are on the many farms, so I plan to ask the owners if it would be okay that we visit them (some horses aren't very well socialized, and some have overprotective owners). Art projects seem like a great idea, until you realize how messy they can be. Or maybe that's part of the fun for them. Hmm... maybe face painting and playing Pocahontas? I'll probably need to lay out a tarp before letting them mess with paints... and pre-fill the tub. @_@
Anyways, as for sleeping, I think it relates partially to them both being completely riled up just before bed. I'll try the milk and honey thing tonight though. We'll see how that turns out! Dr Seusse books are a good bedtime story thing, unless they pick out the tongue twister ones, which is more of a comedy show for them with me struggling to pronounce it.
Now, on to bickering between them. The older one is clearly dominating the younger (as typical). This causes the younger to get vengeful sometimes. It's usually over sharing something they both want to play with. Generally speaking, the youngest wants to do what the older sister does. The oldest is usually content to find something else to do, and isn't the type to 'steal things away' just to be dominant. Now, on the one hand I usually ask the older to share, but I don't want to be seen as favoring the younger (who doesn't quite know me well thanks to the previous legal issues) over the oldest (who already has a very strong bond with me). But I also don't want to be seen by the youngest to be ignoring her in favor of the one who clearly is closer to me. How do you all handle this?
Situational fairness and respect is my biggest concern when tackling their arguments, and so far the violent fight is very very rare (usually just the younger slapping the older, which results in retaliation). For example, during the bath, they got into a splashing game which quickly turned into a fight once the soap began burning eyes. Stopped it by telling them both no more splashing and making a mental note to buy no-tears bubble bath and soap.
Sometimes I feel like I may have read too many parenting books that delve into this child psychology, and for every action I take, I'm remembering dreadful passages from these books that talk about how taking away their Barbie doll will lead to drugs and teen pregnancy later in life. Nonsense, I know, but those books can get in the way of my instinct.
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Hey Kat!
I'll second what Lasa said: If one of your girls is waking up with nightmares, let her come sleep with you. Night terrors are pretty normal fare at certain ages, especially when kids are in unfamiliar situations.
As far as the bickering goes, that's pretty common. It's a little more complex for you than me (I have two teenage daughters, but I'm not divorced so I've never had to deal with situations like your youngest not knowing you very well), but I can tell you what works for me: I've laid down basic ground rules of behavior which simply aren't violated: no hitting, no calling names, etc. Any of those things I'll immediately swoop in on and stop. When my daughters were the same age as yours, I'd be pretty proactive about helping them to resolve problems between themselves - I wouldn't hover to try to prevent bickering, but I'd step in pretty early in the situation. As they got older, I've pulled away to allow them more freedom to resolve these problems themselves, which has worked out for my family, at least.
Probably the most important thing you can do, especially in a new situation like this, is to establish a set of firm rules of what's okay and what's not. It gives children a sense of security to know that there are boundaries to what they can do, and that someone else is being responsible to make sure these boundaries aren't crossed.
As far as parenting books vs. your instinct: probably the most important part of parenting is simply showing up at the party. So long as you're engaged with them, everything else will follow.
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I am no father and I'll maybe sound weird, but from my own childhood experience I can say that clearly establishing rules and lines not to cross ever is one of the best tools you have. As long as the children know that they have a line not to cross, and if they cross it, it's game over for them. Like Shin said, if it's forbidden not to hit, calling names, stealing, harassing (-> very important one, if one of them does not want to be bothered, and if the other yet still does it), etc, as soon as one does it, they can't even claim seriously that you are biased or whatever since they are supposed to know the rules, which are of course extremely clear and kept simple.
Not to be taken negatively, but children mostly work like animals in a very pavlovian way to my eyes. They will always try to break the rules, and do more and more daring things as long as nothing happens in retaliation.
For the rest... Talk to them nicely, and explain why. If there is something I hated the most in my childhood, it was that my parents often chose not to explain and even try to understand. It only served to create gaps and bitterness.
Not sure if it makes sense.
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So, outside of video games and movies, what are things you enjoy doing and want to share that enjoyment with them? If you keep doing those things, I think they will enjoy it.
I will however warn you that the kids freaking out during the activity ruins it for everyone. Only last weekend we tried to go for a bike ride as a family and my son was freaking out the whole time we were moving (he was on one of the attached mini-bike things (http://www.amazon.com/WeeRide-96455-Co-Pilot-Bike-Trailer/dp/B003XNFMLS)).
As they get older, you might come up with "projects" that you do together, like building a model rocket or bird house. These are activities that will probably be cheaper than a trip to the movie theater.
Best of luck. As you said, parenting is serious business.
*I am currently a class B bachelor, since the wife and son went to visit grandparents and I don't have enough paid-time-off built up to join them.
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It's pretty well known that I'm a mom and that I've got child development education under my belt :)
Throw out the books and stop over thinking. Just relax! Siblings will fight and you just fairly discipline them.
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Kat,
Fantastic news. Glad to hear you're getting to spend time with your girls!
If your middle of nowhere is close-ish to a town, small or otherwise, check out its library system. There may be reading programs or free movies or free/cheap crafts programs and childrens' performances going on this summer.
As for art? If you can do it outdoors, you won't need a tarp inside the house. Pick up some cheap t-shirts (a pack of men's XXL undershirts make great sloppy smocks for little ones), have them throw one on over their swimsuits, and let them make as much mess with paint and colored clay as they like. When they're done, just wash them off with the water hose before they go inside.
If they like you reading them stories at night, flip that on its head. Have them work together to read you a story. Or -- and this can be an entire day or even a weekend long project -- have them collaborate on writing you a story or putting together a play to act out for you.
Speaking of outside, there's a lot to be said for doing as much outside as possible if the weather cooperates. Catch fireflies. Build a fire in the backyard (assuming you can) and roast hot dogs and marshmellows. If you can manage it, hang up a sheet and watch your movies outside after the sun goes down. Let them spend a hot day shooting each other with water pistols (or doing target practice with same), or bashing each other with foam pool noodles -- these are all over dollar stores this time of year1.
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1While I'm not a child psychologist, I believe a fair number of the fights my sister and I had with each other as kids (we're about the same age difference as your girls are) could have been prevented if we'd been taught how -- and encouraged -- to work out our mutual aggression in a fun, safe, physical manner with a parental referee close at hand to remind us when we were playing too rough.
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Great news.
I'm mildly afraid to offer any suggestions, since I'm new to parenting myself. Maybe museums, some of them have free days. Same with zoos. From my own childhood, I know that imagination, some chairs and blankets had me entertained for hours, but I was an only child. I would recommend cardboard boxes and markers though.
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Well the visit went well, though it was entirely exhausting. They have SO MUCH ENERGY. Of course, now I'm 'the fun dad', so they don't want to go home. We'll see how long that lasts. :lol:
I have bookmarked this thread and will refer to it for planning the next visit. These are some great ideas. Fireflies have been out in force where I live, so I'm going to buy some kiddie nets for them (little four foot plastic ones) and hope for a light rain again. They seem to come out when it's damp.
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I would strongly advise finding a few repeatable 'hobby' style activities that you can cycle through. Trying to come up with endless 'new' activities is going to kill you and it'll reduce your energy level and perhaps even make you dread the girls visiting!
Ask them what THEY like to do. I know certain hobbies cost money - and you'll want to avoid those - but there are some that either have a reasonable one-time start up or else are free. Some suggested walking, for example - the price of gas to get to the location.
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I'm glad they had fun :)
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I used to make and launch model rockets with dad when I was growing up. Your youngest might be a year or two too young for them yet, though.
If you go for some of the less-fancy ones, it can be a reasonably cheap hobby (or it was when I was into it), and the only continuing purchases are the engines, which are all single-use. You can even make your own launchpads and launching electronics if the kids enjoy building things - we made our own launchpad (rather like the ones used in Florida for the shuttles) as well as a control handset, complete with lights and a safety key. :)
Not quite sure exactly what it's like where you live, but you'll need big, open areas to launch them from, though - and preferably areas that don't get tons of wind.
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A lot of good ideas on this thread and I wish you the best of luck Kat. It's good for your girls to have a parent that really cares and wants to be involved. The only thing I'd add that I didn't see mentioned are American Girl dolls are very popular with girls in that age range in my area and they have some good educational/historical value too with associated craft projects and books. Also during the summer you might want to look into whether any local campgrounds with nice swim facilities or swim clubs allow for guest visitors - it can make for a nice fun outing!
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I also remember that when I was a kid I loved bike riding in forests.
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A lot of good ideas on this thread and I wish you the best of luck Kat. It's good for your girls to have a parent that really cares and wants to be involved. The only thing I'd add that I didn't see mentioned are American Girl dolls are very popular with girls in that age range in my area and they have some good educational/historical value too with associated craft projects and books. Also during the summer you might want to look into whether any local campgrounds with nice swim facilities or swim clubs allow for guest visitors - it can make for a nice fun outing!
I loved my American girl dolls :-)
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In regard to sleep, I can recommend warm milk with honey before going to bed, it helps sleeping soundly!
Tried this tonight, just now.
At first I thought it worked more as a placebo effect, as she's more interested in making anything I attempt a success, especially if she has any say in it. She had like three sips and said it's already working... I was skeptical, but played along.
Seems to have worked though. Fancy that.
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Milk contains melatonin, which is a hormone that is sleep-inducing and leads to a more easy and calm sleep. It also contains Tryptophan, which is metabolized to Serotonine with is also sleep inducing.
Due to the levels of melatonin found in milk being lower than what can be shown to be pharmacologically active and the same being true in regard to the tryptophane, there is certainly a psychological effect at work. One should remember here that we are from birth onward conditioned to associate drinking milk with being safe at our mother's side!
Happy to hear that it worked, seemingly! :)
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Had a chat with the oldest today about the police. Her mother and stepfather do not like the police (more of a cultural dislike), so she is 'scared' of police and assumes they are bad people. I explained to her what the police are for, how they are there to help and make sure people follow the rules. Just like a mommy and daddy make sure little girls follow the rules, the police are there to make sure mommies and daddies (grown-ups) follow the rules too.
I told her about how they are just regular people like me and her mother who go to work every day. She was surprised to learn police work at night too, when everybody is supposed to be sleeping. I explained how even police have mommies and daddies, daughters and sons, sisters and brothers, and some even have kitty cats too. It was mildly surprising to me how scary the police initially were to her. She seemed genuinely surprised to find out they are regular people just making sure grown-ups follow the rules. She even wants to thank a policeman the next time she sees one now.
Granted, I may be simplifying things... and she'll probably develop her own healthy skepticism of police later on in life (especially as a teenager)... but I didn't want her to dislike them and see them as monsters who are 'out to get her family' just because of the visceral emotional reactions adults tend to exhibit when pulled over.
Thoughts? This is an example of me trying to be a good parent without really knowing if I'm doing good or not. >.>
UPDATE 2:
Just got back from taking her to go see the horses that live nearby. She was nervous, but excitedly had her first experience seeing a real horse up close. She's still going on about how big they are (and they were small horses). Good stuff.
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I want my son to be willing to go up to a police officer, firefighter, or even security guard and ask them for help, especially if heavens forbid I or his mother is incapacitated for some reason.
When they are teenagers and able to understand the world a bit better, then we can worry about the "only in emergencies do you need to call the cops" and "always ask for a lawyer to be present when you are being questioned by a government agent."
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DERP.
I totally forgot to mention that she should look for police to ask them for help. Had the whole conversation without actually saying she should ask police for help if she's ever lost or scared. Seems so obvious now that you mention it, but I forgot to mention it. I'll have a sequel conversation once she's not distracted by hula-hoops.
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My dad is a retired deputy sheriff. Good convo to have :-)
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Buy Warhammer minis
Teach them how to paint them well
???? (Ebay)
Profit!
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Mealtime: An Exercise In Frustration, Ending With Leftovers
ALRIGHT. So, my Youngest (4) has issues with eating. She's at that stage where she's very very picky about what she will eat and poorly judges how hungry she is. She also doesn't really understand the concept of food waste, which is normal. All this is typical, or so I hear, that kids will often ask for food they don't have the room for, simply because the other child actually is hungry or because they thought about the food. Or that they will find seemingly preposterous reasons for why they don't like it. Like a tiny flake of parsley on the noodle, so the rest of the bowl is ruined. In some cases, I can eat what they don't want, but more often than not I'm simply overwhelmed with leftovers.
My child, in specific, tends to ask for something specific, take a few bites, and want something different - refusing to eat what she asked for and has been given. At first, I tried to play along, but it quickly became apparent that we were throwing away far more than she actually ate. Now we're at an impasse, and she is beginning to get upset and complain to the angry-ex that [other parent] won't give her any food, which is simply untrue!
In smaller situations where she demonstrates this indecisiveness on food several times and I get frustrated and give her the choice of what she has in front of her or nothing at all, she will often choose nothing and then be angry with me. During major mealtimes like Dinner or Breakfast or Lunch we'll compromise and allow her to skip the less important parts of the meal, having her eat the meat and veggies and skip the potatoes, for example.
How do you as parents handle this? Do you cook smaller special-snowflake meals for the picky eater, or try to enforce a sense of "Eat What You're Given"? Do you go somewhere in the middle? How do you handle leftovers, or changed minds, or requests for meals that cannot be saved (like a bowl of cereal with milk)? How do you tell the difference between boredom requests for food, and actual hunger?
The best idea I can come up with is to cease giving food at any time of day it's requested, and set specific times for meals that they'll need to wait for. That way, we can be sure they are ready for the meals, have not overeaten, and will be less likely to waste food.
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Compromising is the worst idea with kids from what I know. They will see their whining works and will try to push the line even further every time. And then they eventually become detestable pricks. It's often best to make them understand that you can be nice to them as long as they are nice themselves. Which means here, eating their food and stfu. I don't count the times where I, as a kid, was forced to eat what I was given and I didn't even have the choice not to eat anything at all. It worked, since I eventually grudgingly ate what was given.
I was even threatened at times to be forced to eat it like gooses are fed with a funnel, as silly as it sounds, children will believe everything, and it worked too. Or other threats like "if you don't eat it now you will eat it at breakfast tomorrow"... And you usually don't want to eat leftovers of vegetables or meat at breakfast.
Though at times they tried to bait me into doing it with a promising dessert, or that kind of stuff. It helped at little, and makes the kid more quick to eat and eager to get to the dessert in question.
I'm not a parent though, only my own experience of what I have witnessed in my family.
Edit : I want to add that it may sound rude, but it wasn't really. It was just being firm, and eventually me and my brother/sister got used rather fast to it. We used to continue to complain, but as we perfectly knew how it was going to end (as usual), it didnt last too long.
Edit 2 : i'm no specialist, but giving food at any time in the day is NO NO NO from every doctor and sources I have heard. Its paving its way to obesity and very bad habits. Kids have to learn there are times to eat, and get along with it.
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I am in slightly different situation with my son, because he has to eat all his carbs in a timely fashion.
I definitely think defined meal and snack times help. You can also try including them in meal planning, this creates the catch-22 of they need to eat what they helped come up with.
Having a planned simple dessert (like a chocolate square or scope of ice cream), with the condition of eating the rest of the meal first, provides a reward for good behavior. If she doesn't finish the main meal, then clearly there is no room for the small dessert.
Lastly, while it is frustrating as the parent, not excusing them from the table until their plate is clean is a classic. However, you need to sit there until they are done! For you, it maybe possible to use the older one being excused and playing as a carrot for the young one to eat up.
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Lastly, while it is frustrating as the parent, not excusing them from the table until their plate is clean is a classic. However, you need to sit there until they are done! For you, it maybe possible to use the older one being excused and playing as a carrot for the young one to eat up.
That is what my mother did with me, except she did not stay there with me the whole time. I simply wasn't allowed to get up from the table and play until I was done. Then again, I tended to do what I was told. She doesn't. I'll push the food more forcefully, as I already have been doing, "Take another bite!".
I'll see about working out defined meal times, I think. It seems to be the most reasonable solution.
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And you usually don't want to eat leftovers of vegetables or meat at breakfast.
Leftovers are an excellent breakfast!
...though often a better lunch, so I generally save them up and cerealise for breakfast.
Flippancy aside, I don't recall ever having issues with food. I suspect that in pre-memory days, I had a very 'eat what you're given' approach taken with me, and it stuck. I find picky eaters highly irritating - I remember staying with a friend's family for a while, and the sister (in her late teens) going out of her way to make her own junk food rather than partaking in the same as the rest of us - including, on one occasion, something that I'd specially made for everyone. I was ready to chew carpet over that. Nice girl, but... grrr. Do everyone (yourself included) a favour, and don't let the little 'un develop that habit.
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And you usually don't want to eat leftovers of vegetables or meat at breakfast.
Leftovers are an excellent breakfast!
...though often a better lunch, so I generally save them up and cerealise for breakfast.
Not for kids! Daughter wanted plain noodles, so I served her some plain leftover noodles. NOPE.
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Cold plain noodles... mmm, that's one that doesn't work so well. Now, suitably fried with a few things, that's a different matter.
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Bookmarking for the far future
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Youngest daughter's night fears while sleeping at my place have been solved with the addition of a television into the room. I was resistant to the idea because I never had a TV growing up in my room, so I didn't think she needed it.
Well, I did a trial run over the last weekend by letting her go to bed to the show of Spongebob (their favorite) set to the absolute minimum volume. It was pretty much an animated nightlight that they could hear, but not enough to keep them awake. They were out like a light within 5 minutes.
What's even more remarkable is that neither one of them had nightmares that night and called for help. My best guess is that by letting them go to bed with TV, they fell asleep calmly instead of anxiously, and thus enjoyed their rest instead of suffering bad dreams.
Learn something new every day, especially as a parent. :s :lol:
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Ambient noise and nightlight for the win! Glad it worked out well.