Backstage - OOC Forums

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

That Frentix is a very powerful painkiller?

Pages: 1 [2]

Author Topic: An alternative FW?  (Read 3100 times)

Senn Typhos

  • Pod Captain
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 944
  • Strong, Silent Type
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #15 on: 15 Jan 2012, 16:40 »

re: Caldari and world domination; sure they have a lot of corporate influence, but that doesn't translate to sociocultural influence that Gallente megacorps do. It's like how the Japanese/Chinese make a lot of our stuff, but we're not exactly all wearing Japanese/Chinese clothing. The Federation is built to accept and incorporate new peoples, and they wouldn't mind making everyone Gallente (or "free" in their dictionary). The Amarr, too, seek to make everyone Amarrian. Meanwhile, if the Caldari try to make everyone Caldari, they lose their identity, as they're all culturally grounded to one world (Caldari Prime, to the point they'll kill and die for it).

I suppose it's more the point that the nature of the current conflict feels a bit...imbalanced? The Gallente fighting a much smaller state while only off-handedly being at war with the true threat to 'galactic peace' (Amarr) doesn't feel like it has much gravity. What happens if the Caldari wins? Well, the Gallente acknowledge Caldari Prime is theirs, and they go back to the status quo. The Gallente public also wouldn't tolerate a 'subjugation' of the Caldari because "that's not very nice and we don't/shouldn't do that", so happens when they win? Same thing with Minmatar v Amarr.

In which case, it's more an advocating of a much larger war scenario. If the Amarr win this theoritical war, they enslave everyone. If the Gallente/Minmatar side does, billions get liberated and everyone is happy and joyful over this. That's just a personal preference, in which case, of having a "high stakes" war. The Amarr/Minmatar side might appear high stakes if the Amarr win, but in truth, the Gallente wouldn't allow the Minmatar to be conquered (and neither would CONCORD).

From CCP's developer perspective, it's all about having a "war" while preserving the status quo of the game, which I think is the issue of it. In which case it's more like a border conflict. Depends which of the two you like.

I think you're still vastly overestimating the importance of Gallente popular conception. Just because the prospect of slavery is a negative influence in their eyes doesn't mean the average citizen would give a damn about solving the problem, nor does it mean a government would put effort into reversing it. I could bring up a dozen real-world parallels, but I won't.

The State doesn't want domination, I think you're correct there. But they could still consider plenty of planets and systems "theirs," and want them back fully. Demilitarizing Intaki and leaving it under State control would be one, Caldari Prime is obviously another. Grudges don't go away easily, it would basically require a tremendous effort to put an end to those hostilities, and an even greater effort to keep them from surfacing again. Just because the State is small doesn't make it less of a power in the cluster, in fact, it's what drove its navy to become the most potent in New Eden.

What I do agree with is that a switch-up would be refreshing. Perhaps Gallente vs. Amarr, and Caldari vs. Matari? Trading off opponents for various strategic reasons, encourage new rivalries in the FW scene?
Logged
An important reminder for Placid RPers

One day they woke me up
So I could live forever
It's such a shame the same
Will never happen to you

Lyn Farel

  • Guest
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #16 on: 16 Jan 2012, 07:22 »

I like Shalira idea, but how do you justify that Khanid strenghten their autonomy while the last years have proved exactly the opposite ? Now Khanid II is once again part of the privy council (even as advisor only). That would require some sort of important event to backpedal like this.

Now then, I do think that one can find casus belli between all the factions, whatever you may think of. It is not really hard, they all have their grudges against the other ones. Yes, even the Gallente vs the Minmatar. Like the Amarr / Caldari, they do not share a lot of things (unlike what people always tend to think). Not that a free for all would be a good solution though, but the whole thing gets more granular and offers more possibilities. Especially when you start to add new minor factions in the equation, like for example the Ammatar Mandate, which can be a key actor where with it alone, you might be able to put at war 3 of the 4 empires : the Amarr vs the Republic because its obvious, but also the Caldari vs the Minmatar for business opportunities (as stated in the chronicles).

Besides this, I think like Senn that people tend to overestimate the implication and patriotism of the average dude, whatever faction he is living in. Sure you will always find activists here and there, but seriously, why even the usual Minmatar worker would care about his so called "brothers" that have been enslaved for centuries, that he has never seen in his life, and with whom he does not even share something (except blood ?). Because of a national feeling ? Propaganda ? Sure. Like IRL when the media start to talk about Islam or China all the day, saying "booooo". But does that make the average citizen willing to go to war with them ? Not really. They do not care. People usually care about themselves first, thats human, and after, they extend that to their families, whatever their culture is. But the people actually "going activist" are minorities compared to the "masses". I am no fool, it is quite obvious for me that why factions, even in Eve, are fighting each other, is for pure political agendas, even the Amarr and the Minmatar. Not for the ideological sugarcoat. Not anymore at least.
« Last Edit: 16 Jan 2012, 07:24 by Lyn Farel »
Logged

Seriphyn

  • Demigod
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2118
  • New and improved, and only in FFXIV
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #17 on: 16 Jan 2012, 10:57 »

When computer engineers write political/IR fiction.

Folk wouldn't tolerate a psychologist writing about quantum theory regarding starship propulsion or whatever...(see, even I butchered that)...getting a decent soft scientist to write about soft subjects in EVE might help a lot.
Logged

Robert Kauliford

  • Clonejack
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 28
    • Symon's Blog
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #18 on: 16 Jan 2012, 15:43 »

First off by assuming people don't care about nationalism is imposing a very modern/western outlook on the eve universe. Nationalism through various means has been an extremely potent issue since the idea of the nation state as more than just a political and geographic entity first began to emerge in the 18th century. You only have to look at the European Union as it stands to see how easily nationalist feeling trumps the greater good.

Overall I like the idea of minor factions pitching in, I was once a member of a minor faction after all. In terms of PF its reasonable to suppose that with the rise of the Sansha threat Concord rescinds the Militia act introduced after the Empyrean war. This would lead to most of the factions covertly supporting their relevant militias through a proxy system which is closer in many ways to the conflict we're already having
Logged

Caellach Marellus

  • CONCORD Poster Boy.
  • Omelette
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 332
  • Beware of Geeks bearing GIFs.
    • The Goblin's Cave
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #19 on: 16 Jan 2012, 19:04 »

If there's a series of Pirate factions, can has CONCORD faction to go against them?

Lawful neutral needs love too. But in general I believe facwar needs a reset, but then again the entire story needs an update.
Logged
"I blame society for anything I've said that you disagree with."

Alain Colcer

  • Pod Captain
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 857
Re: An alternative FW?
« Reply #20 on: 17 Jan 2012, 05:43 »

Logged
Pages: 1 [2]