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EVE-Online RP Discussion and Resources => EVE Character Development => Topic started by: Urthel Drengist on 22 Dec 2014, 19:50
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Hey all,
I have been playing Eve since 2008??or something like that, but there had been multiple times where I had been stopping the game and taking this "break" for it.
After trying a bunch of games and what not, I finally came to the conclusion that EVE online is the game I want to be part of :cube: :psyccp:....so long story short, I am back for good :psyccp:
However, 2 or more years ago I was making my babysteps in RPing and didnt really place the necessary thought behind it while playing EVE online (again :cube:). Now as I am way more matured and having done heavy RP in other MMORPGS I have noticed that my main character in EVE online has some fundamental flaws character creation wise, and his backstory is inconsistent and needs to change.
But the point is that I have no idea how I can do that in a sort of "smooth" way. Urthel has already come in contact with various other capsuleers and there have been several posts(although old n gone) in IGS of him stating things that...well I want them "gone".
So have you ever had a problem similar like mine? Do you have a particular suggestion, technique etc to help me "rewrite" Urthel in a "smooth" kind of way?
Thank you in advance.
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Without the exact specifics, it's hard for me to say. That said, there's typically a way to downplay (or at least twist so they fit better) a factor in the backstory.
If you don't want to talk about them in an open thread, feel free to PM or message me ingame for advice on the specifics.
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Usually you can change and go back to the factory as long as it was never really made public or released.
For what has been though, it's another story and can be painful. Hopefully you have a lot of scify tools at your disposal. It's not entirely hard in itself to come with a totally different person in that setting (and i'm not even speaking of someone that has just 'changed' over the years, it can be someone completely different). Of course, you will have to take into account the old character in the background itself since it can hardly be erased...
But there is a trick I think. Think about History and how it is written. It's written depending on the perspective of its authors. You can twist the perspective and interpretation pretty hard if you want to. Something that happened in a way can actually be said to have been totally different... To a certain point.
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Amnesia?
Booster induced psychosis?
A little 'hand wavium' might help in a pinch. Something could happen during the cloning procedure to make the mind transfer corrupted/ incomplete.
I don't see a problem with a complete scrapping of the old and construction of the new. It only becomes difficult if you are already actively role-playing with a group of others and your background is an integral part of the script.
For example, there are former Sanshas who have somehow re-written a new path for their characters to follow. Since Sanshas are essentially cyborgs who share a hive mind, you would think this return would be impossible. Despite this, the characters are able to affect the change. Nobody faults them for doing a 180 turn with their character and taking them in a new direction.
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Other RPers might not have as long of a memory as you might think.
Remember we spend a lot of time thinking about our characters but no one else does. So something you said years ago is likely very, very far from anyone's memory.
Just go have fun
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I actually disagree Silas, other RPers in many cases have a very long memory.
Someone will dig up dirt to use as leverage, or to discredit your character while making theirs look good, or just as a gossip weapon. Its very hard to escape that.
At a certain point, the best thing to do if you want to completely void the past is to re-roll the character, because there will be people who ignore your retcons and pull up old 'bad' things your character has done no matter how nicely you ask OOC for them not to.
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Live with the consequences of what you've done. It's the one thing that separates Eve from every other MMO out there. No server changes, no name-changes, no escaping what you've done. tl;dr, deal with it. It's not always pleasant, it's not convenient and it doesn't let you off the hook when you fuck up, but it gives everything you do weight.
I certainly judge the others in the community on that metric. Do they just want to pretend they haven't done this or that? Lowest rung on on my respect meter. Buck up and move on, without pretending? Top rung.
If there's flat out derps in your personal history, just embrace them and blame mental illness or whatever else works for your particular situation, but do acknowledge them if they come up.
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I have to agree with Miz. Deal with the consequences ICly. I've had to deal with a lot of my character's choices over the years. It hasn't always been fun, but it's very rewarding when I'm able to accomplish my character's goals in spite of the challenge. Fewer people than you think will likely remember what your character did or didn't do. Only some of them will hold it against your character or try to use it against them, but they'll likely do that sort of thing whether you retcon or not.
Speaking from personal experience. You'd be surprised how well owning up to an IC mistake can work.
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So have you ever had a problem similar like mine? Do you have a particular suggestion, technique etc to help me "rewrite" Urthel in a "smooth" kind of way?
Thank you in advance.
Hej! I read from your post, that you want to rewrite your char story for youself, basically, not so much for others. As already mentioned above, I would not suggest to smooth anything. Otherwise you may end up even more detached from the char. A possible technique could be framing and contextualisation. Put everything that appears to be weird or annoying together and find a suitable frame for it (e.g. mental illness, alcoholism, patriotic phase, bad influence etc.). Then put it all into a new context that suits you (e.g. you char is now running away from it, was forced to behave this way, had a hard time to overcome, is ashamed now, tries to hide it, tries to make it better, or even trying to find out what really happend those days etc.). Only a suggestion, though. Might or might not fit your RP style. :)
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Roll with it. Deal with it. It creates good content for your character, for you and possibly those around you. Use it to fuel your RP rather than to detract from it.
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I admit I'm much more of the roleplay-as-creative-writing breed as opposed to the roleplay-as-a-dynamic-experience one, but I'd disagree with most of the people here and say that if you feel your old backstory is badly put together, you should reboot regardless of the difficulties, as the alternative usually just becoming convoluted and awkward with all the explanations, and leaving you put off from the whole thing later on, in my experience.
While I'd recommend rolling a new character for this in spite of it being a pain and repurposing your current one as an OOC alt just for a truly fresh start, I don't think retconning your current one would be that terrible. Despite what people will tell you, all roleplay is ultimately consenual - If someone brings up your characters past to them, it's easy to just go to them and ask politely if they'd consider it no longer applicable, and if they refuse, just not interact with them any longer.
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Anya has never talked to Urthel so I don't know how big or bad the retcon has to be. My advice is to play who you want to play. You can always change how Urthel looks and make him who you want to be. Or just be a new person and keep Urthel.
I have retconned Anya a few times. She was a good guy in Provibloc when I first made her, then an explorer in Anoikis, a fw awoxer, then I tried roleplaying her as a space goblin ( :twisted: ), then she tried to be Sani Sabik, and now she is a Blood Raider. A lot a crap happened through all that but she won't deny any of it. Even now, I am trying to make her more of a religious heretic than a vampire lesbian. Still I won't try to retcon all the fun she (I) had while being vampire lesbo.
Think about all those lives Urthel has been a part of either for better or worse. Maybe there are people who want to see the old Urthel one last time.
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Rewrite it as you see fit if you're just getting back. If people won't respect your wishes OOCly, block them, dismiss the accusations against you as capsuleer dementia. Don't let some jerks ruin your fun.
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I've seen this happen and it's not exactly fair to everyone else. If someone remembers you from a previous incarnation of that character, and talks to you on that basis, and then you go "Oh, I know thats what this character was but they are this now, please just roll with it" It makes everything incredibly awkward.
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How is it awkward?
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"Hi there. Please interupt your characters perception of events and clear out from your memory all interactions you have had with this character, including those that took place in front of other people. Also, please tell those people that this interaction which they witnessed never took place"
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You need to be more blunt like that sometimes.
OK, that's logical. But like, say this is someone who said, one line, like...4 years ago. However many years ago. The line could be like I am loyal to blah, blah being whatever bad guy good guy etc etc. And there wasn't really much more than that. I don't feel it's hawkward then.
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You need to be more blunt like that sometimes.
OK, that's logical. But like, say this is someone who said, one line, like...4 years ago. However many years ago. The line could be like I am loyal to blah, blah being whatever bad guy good guy etc etc. And there wasn't really much more than that. I don't feel it's hawkward then.
It doesn't have to be, and for the most part people might not even remember. But there will always be that one asshole who pulls up the 4 year old archived post to prove how terrible your character is. You can either accept it, shrug it off making an IC excuse for it and move on, (my personal recommendation) or you can try to actively edit prior events OOC. If you do, a lot of people will accept it, but there will still be that one asshole who will refuse to accept the retcon and continue using that past event to call out your character.
The Third Option is to reroll completely.
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No. Third option is remove asshole kebab (no really, shoot the bastard and ruin his picnic until he stops).
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Nah. This is EVE. You can get called on stuff and yeah you can say "Let's shoot the asshole until he stops being an asshole" but that just isn't how things work. The best way to handle this is to completely own everything your character is doing, and has done.
Want to start fresh? You have to start fresh. New character, from the beginning. Otherwise, you're just setting yourself up for future embarassment.
Sure, it is a little bit of assholely thing, but this is EVE. All Sandcastles Can Be Kicked.
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Tib still has a very valid point.
It's one thing to quietly retcon your character and/or events involving them if you had very little or very infrequent exposure with that character to others. It's another entirely if what you're trying to rewrite involved many other people over a long period of time, and would affect them, and large amounts of their own RP.
The whole "RP is consensual" thing is a two-way street: trying to rewrite events that have effects and consequences on other characters for (potentially) years to come in a universe where these kinds of things stick with people wherever they go is just as rude - if not incredibly more rude - than those people who might go "wait, uh, no, you did do X at Y place at Z time" when you try to claim otherwise.
tl;dr depending on the scope of the intended changes, the "asshole kebab" is actually more often than not the person trying to retcon their own shit. Not the people who go "uh no, fuck you" in response to it.
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If it's something that involved a lot of people, I agree. Like...if Silas suddenly went full on pro-Amarr, God save the Empress, death to Blooders (LOOOOL), you couldn't retcon the past of Silas.
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It's not about the number of characters involved. It's about the reach of the effects of that RP. The number of people affected usually will become large eventually regardless of how many people were initially involved: one private interaction between two characters can affect subsequent interactions with many, many other characters given a sufficient period of time for those interactions to occur.
Ripples in a pond.
Let me give an example: EVERY single one of Morwen's interactions with other people over the last year or so has been directly influenced by every other interaction (or lack thereof) with other people that came before it in that timeframe.
If, let's say for argument's sake, Esna or Ava wanted to say that, no, their character had actually been around more or had done more to try and interact with Morwen during that period, I'd tell them no, despite them being my friends and despite it appearing on the surface to be just a one-to-one thing. Because even a seemingly private change like that, of one person going out of their way to do something different, in private, could have - and would have, in this case - drastically changed every subsequent interaction afterward, private and public.
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I have to agree with several here, I think you're better off not retconning. I'd suggest coming up with a way to make the changes you want ICly.
For example, I'm trying to make Jenn less of an emotional trainwreck (no, really... stop laughing) and to remove some of the IC limitations I placed on her. It's frustrating at time, and can be challenging.
But, for those that do remember your character from two years ago, it's less jarring. It also provides you and others, with some RP content to participate in and interact with (which reminds again that I owe Haria some fiction).
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But there will always be that one asshole who pulls up the 4 year old archived post to prove how terrible your character is.
That person is not an asshole. You put something into a community RP pool and that thing happened, it's the community pool to dredge and bring things up as they please.
A lot of you look at this like it's a bad thing.
Bad things happening to your character: your character losing, being made a fool, your character being pew pewed, is not those things happening to you.
It makes it a more believable virtual world, where people make mistakes, bad things happen, and none of us are perfect.
This is probably my #1 gripe about most RPers is their desire for immunity from repercussions and desire to be perfect space heroes with no flaws who never lose. Nothing ever risked, nothing ever lost, always perfect in every way.
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And what happens when this is used on a mistake a genuinely new player made long ago? And it is used to label them IC and OOC? We just let their one mistake ruin it all?
If so then oh well. Guess I'm a bad cause Id help the newb
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And what happens when this is used on a mistake a genuinely new player made long ago? And it is used to label them IC and OOC? We just let their one mistake ruin it all?
If so then oh well. Guess I'm a bad cause Id help the newb
I don't think this is the case in this situation? I think early noob things can probably be handwaved with little issue. And honestly like I said earlier, no one tracks our every move with that precision, especially just starting out. And even if they did you can explain it away in all sorts of ways.
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Fair enough. I dunno why but when it comes to new RPers this shit triggers me. They should be cultivated positively. Not lold away. NOT SAYING SOMEONE CONDONED IT HERE. Just a gear I got that grinds.
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Fair enough. I dunno why but when it comes to new RPers this shit triggers me. They should be cultivated positively. Not lold away. NOT SAYING SOMEONE CONDONED IT HERE. Just a gear I got that grinds.
STOP GRINDING MY GEARS ANSLO :bear:
I think my overall point is that saying a bunch of dumb things that your character isn't happy about isn't the end of the world sort of thing requiring a re-roll and biomassing.
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Fair enough.
And I'll stop grinding them when you come join us~SCOPEWORKSISRECRUITING
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"No, that's the other Urthel Drengist. That guy's a jerk."
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"No, that's the other Urthel Drengist. That guy's a jerk."
lol, that's rather awesome actually. It could be explained in so many different ways..
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Especially now they ARE recycling names.
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I was more thinking about Jekyll/Hyde. :)
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Depending on how much of a big deal you made of it back in the day, I'd either ignore it and explain at need (IC or OOC, as appropriate) that you didn't know what the hell you were talking about back then, or ...
... maybe lampshade it?
"Yeah, I was kinda insecure back then. I mean, I'd just gotten my pilot's license, right? And I was really just a kid, so ... I wanted to impress you all. And so ... yeah, I lied a lot. Made a bunch of stuff up. It was immature, and I'm not proud of it, but there it is."
People tend to respect those who own up to their mistakes. Aria, forum warrior that she was, went out of her way to weaponize that technique (it's hard to build up much of an advantage against someone who wins back 3/4ths of a point for every point you score).
For the record, I have no recollection of what you might have said or done back in the day.